www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Is there a priest shortage?

I have not experienced seminary, but if it is anything like a typical university and uses the lecture method, all I have to say is "who needs it?". Lectures are rarely done well and are a grossly inefficient and expensive way to transmit knowledge. If a seminary uses a "Great Books" seminar method (a la St. John's College or Thomas Aquinas College) to read and discuss the actual Fathers (as opposed to contemporary excrement), then its existence may be justified. Nevertheless, I agree that parish level training is probably the only way for the Byzantine Catholic Church to survive.

I recently met a Ukranian Orthodox priest who has been in his parish his entire life. He always felt the call to the priesthood but wasn't sure. He was married, has a family and is part of running the family business. After communicating with his parish priest and bishop he realized he could respond to God's call! I believe the Antiochian's have courses on line. So the "nuts and bolts" were addressed with formal on-line classes. However, he worked at the local level with his pastor and the local Orthodox community to learn putting it into practice. He is now the pastor of the parish he grew up in. He still runs the family business. I'm sure life isn't easy, but he's happy. He is following God's will and I can see he is doing a great job. The parishioners I have spoken with love him.

JOb,

That is a wonderful story. I pray that it will be reproduced countless times. I think it is our future if we are to have one.

I don't regret my seminary years along with graduate school. I did what they called "field training" then. But even with the field training much was left out. We used mostly a secular lecture model for the courses. Ironically, I'm a lecturer myself but I do incorporate as much discussion as possible. Still I'm not trying to prepare people for the priesthood.

Moreover, it does seem that God is trying to tell us something when we only have three seminarians (or is it two?) Is He saying He doesn't need us to exist any longer? Is He saying we are to change our ways and show the world a better way of training priests?

CDL

Greetings all,

I personally think the priesthood could be developed through the sub-orders and the diaconate in the field, with some additional academic work as proposed here.

But because the Ruthenians are not a Patriarchal church I suppose that Rome would have to approve any changes to the formation policy of priests, and I doubt that they would welcome any creative proposals to develop priest-candidates (even if they are traditional).

I do think that it would make sense to combine the seminary facilities of the Byzantine churches in North America, but the issue of control of the seminary is important. If it just becomes another institution governed from Rome the result may be less desireable than what you have already.

+T+
Michael

Dear Michael,

Why would a consolidated Byzantine Seminary have to be controlled by Rome? Why could it not be run by GOARCH, or the OCA, or ACROD, etc?

We all share the same heritage, and this may be a solution to re-easternizing (is that a word?) the Byzantine Church, as our +Blessed John-Paul II instructed.

(for me, I believe it should be easy to change ages unto ages into forever and ever when and if the time comes. )

In Christ,

Michael

Is our perception of "priest shortage" relative? Is there an ideal priest-to-congregation ratio?

Read Fr. John McCloskey's "critical" assessment of the Catholic Church in the U.S. here [catholicity.com] ?

Amado

Hmmm...

Fr McCloskey writes:

(emphasis added)

given that Latin priests are celibate, one would hope the good Father's definition of "virile" is different from what is found in the Merriam-Websters Dictionary :

Dear Fr. Deacon John:

I also saw that characterization but kept it to myself!

Perhaps, Fr. McClosky was just emphasizing the need for "go to" and "no-nonsense" priests in the Church, especially for married men or those capable of getting married in the Eastern Churches.

Amado

I don�t see anything odd about the characterization. The qualities for being a good husband and a good father are the same for those to be a good priest. Except that a priest who has taken the vow of celibacy uses self-discipline. I surely hope that no one is suggesting that they would prefer candidates for the priesthood to NOT have �the nature, properties, or qualities of an adult male� or to NOT be �capable of functioning as a male in copulation� should they have accepted the vocation to marriage instead of the vocation to the celibate priesthood.



Oh, yeah, the article was very interesting!

Dear Nathan,

There is a priest shortage, there has been for a very long time. And the problem won't got away until we do two things:

a) Raise good large (in that order exactly)families in the Byzantine Catholic faith. If the kids don't have the relationship, they're not gonna wanna be priests.

b) Actually let in more people that have orthodox views. I've heard that most seminaries today are very very selective to the point of excluding people who actually do have a vocation. Stop playing politics, bishops! Do God's will and not your own!

The answer is yes. One priest for an entire state or multiple state area cannot be otherwise. Or in my case, one deacon for an entire state. The nearest full-tiime Greek Catholic priest lives in the next state over.

I've lost track of the number of Orthodox priests I've met who have a full time job to support their mission activity. That seems the most reasonable path to emulate.
DD

Lost&Found I have heard now and forever and ever used in an Orthodox church before.

I think perhaps it is an opportune time to again post the link to Fr. Maximos Davies' (from Holy Resurrection Monastery) excellent article:

http://www.firstthings.com/ftissues/ft0212/opinion/davies.html
DD

I am amazed that the Byzantine churchs has not done anything about the subdiaconate. The Latin Rite did ages by creating instituted Acolytes and training them up. One does not need a degree to to serve the Liturgy, to MC it and make sure all runs smoothly. It's not a child's job to serve the liturgy but they do have a role under the subdiacons guidance. Hopefully they will rise through the ranks and become subdeacons. I noted the comment about Deacons filling a void. I may have missed it but it is not the vocation of Deacons to fill any void apart from the one that should have a Deacon in it. It is so strnage that you dont seem to ordain Married men. We do in Australia and the Latin Rite has not gone into crisis mode. It was the Latin bishops who were the main supported for this to occur.

Wow, I love Davies' article. He has numerous insights from which the whole Church, East and West, could greatly benefit.