www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology A Private Retreat at Holy Resurrection Monastery

Dear Brother David,

Yes, realistic, realistic . . . don't be pessimistic about that either

You don't need a spiritual Father to bless you to fulfill a particular rule of prayer - it is difficult to find one and I would love to have Fr. Mark as such if I lived in England.

Or else Angela if I lived in Scotland.

Or the Administrator if I lived in Virginia.

I'd love to have you as a spiritual guide, since that would have you focus on me and my problems - and you would then see what real problems are all about . . .

Alex

David,

Yes, it is not easy to find a spiritual father or mother but it is important. You already have access to people who can help you with this. In the meantime find someone who has a good prayer life and can assist you in developing a good rule of prayer.

Also, the lectionary provided in the back of the Orthodox Study Bible is almost identical to our Ruthenian lectionary. The differences are no greater than those between our Ruthenian lectionary and the Melkite lectionary. It is perfectly sufficient for your needs. The Lord will not strike you dead for reading a different selection from the Holy Scriptures two or three times a year. If you don�t wish to match up the cycle with the calendar you can obtain a liturgical wall calendar from any parish or the Seminary Press with this information for each day of the liturgical year.

Admin

Dear Brother David,

I would take the Administrator's advice, if I were you!

You should consider him your "online spiritual father" as do I.

And I haven't turned out all that bad, have I?

O.K., bad example, bad example . . .

Alex

Alex,
Yes, the Admin is one of the sources that I use, along with yourself and a couple of others here.

As for finding someone with a good prayer life to help me with a prayer rule, I do not know of anyone..... Thing is, I would like to do this in person rather than online, if you can understand what I mean. Just as finding a spiritual father that I can meet with personally at the very least monthly....

As for the scripture reading.... I did a search on the cell rule you listed and found this.... The Cell Rule of Five Hundred of the Optina Monastery [orthodoxinfo.com]

I think the reading plan here sounds nice.

One chapter from the Gospel in order, beginning first with the Gospel of Matthew, to the last chapter of the Gospel of John, and two chapters from the Epistle, likewise in order, beginning with the Acts of the holy Apostles and ending with the last chapter of the Apocalypse of Saint John the Theologian. The last seven chapters of the Apocalypse are read one a day. In this way the last chapter is read on exactly the same day as the last chapter of the Gospel of John. Then, after the completion of the reading of the whole New Testament, in this manner they begin again from the first chapters a new cycle of reading in precisely the same order. From the Psalter they read one kathisma a day, beginning with the first and ending with the last.

There is no place for me to find the readings of the church, except for the source you listed... The Orthodox Study Bible, the Melkite parish I attend does not have a wall calendar, I will have to wait till I visit St George's again to get one.

The main thing I love about the liturgical wall calendar, more so than the readings, is that it lists the saints for the day.

David

Dear Brother David,

The Jordanville-published monastic rules also include that plan for reading the New Testament.

One could read more, but always in a 1/2 proportion.

The reading of the Psalter is graduated. Monastic beginners do three Kathismata per day, Staurophores do four, and those of the Great Schema do seven.

The Jesus Prayer nightly rule begins with everyone in Church, Lestovkas and prayer ropes in hand.

The leader chants the Prayer out loud three times to begin with.

Then the Brothers do 30 prostrations with the Prayer and then stand to say the remaining 70 in silence. And they do this ten times so that they have fulfilled 300 prostrations and 600 prayers (in truth, more!).

The Rule of St Pachomios prescribes 100 prayers at the beginning of each hour of the day - and night for a total of 2400, but 300 at three o'clock.

The Psalmic phrase from Psalm 118: Seven times daily do I praise Thee . . . is at the root of the seven-fold daily Office, as you know, and Orthodox monks have done seven kathismata, seven akathists etc. at each of the seven daily vigils.

The Old Believers prescribe a minimum of seven prayer ropes or Lestovkas daily in this same spirit.

Alex

Dear Father Mark!

Could you kindly share with us information regarding rules of prayer for those who are away from home 12 hours and more?

Thank you!

Alex

The information posted by Alex is good but much too complicated and advanced for us lay folks who need to get up at the crack of dawn and are gone from home all day. Also, David�s expectation of a personal, monthly meeting with a spiritual father or mother is probably a bit unrealistic. A couple of hours three or four times over a year would be much more reasonable for the average lay person.

David has already wisely noted that his time in the morning is limited, since he needs to get out of the house and off to work. Keeping things as simple as possible is necessary. I recommend a very simple version of the Cell Rule that has already been discussed:

Morning Prayer
Begin with the usual opening prayers (�Through the prayers of our holy fathers��, �Heavenly King� and etc.). Then pray Psalm 50 and �It is truly proper�. Then pray The Jesus Prayer one hundred and fifty times. Conclude with the usual ending (�Glory�now and ever�.� and again �Through the prayers of our Holy Fathers, Lord Jesus Christ our God, have mercy on us. Amen�). During the Great Fast add the Ephraim Prayer with prostrations and nothing else. During Pascha add �Christ is Risen� three times at the beginning and replace �It is truly proper� with �The angel exclaimed�. All of this should take no more than 10-15 minutes.

Follow this rule without change each morning for six full months before considering any changes.

I can publish a full version of this suitable for printing if anyone wants it and does not have access to the texts.

Dear Administrator,

Yes, indeed - the rule you have posted is contained in the 16th century Old Rite text "Son of the Church!"

And you truly are!

Alex

Admin,
I am glad you said this as I was thinking it!

Also, I agree, for the average lay person, a couple of hours three or four times a year is great, but I am no average lay person .

I am currently discerning the monastic life, that is why I wish to meet more often with a spiritual father. This is also why it is so hard for me to find one.... That is I know a couple of people who would work out great as a spiritual father, but when they hear the word monastic, they shy away and tell me to find a monk, as they know nothing about the monastic life. There lies my problem.

Not many who feel comfortable in the role of a spiritual father feel comfortable in that same role to some one who is discerning a vocation.

This is great and I think I could handle this in the morning.

Could you please publish this for me? I could chase everything down, but it would be much easier and quicker.... Thanks!

David

Dear Brother David,

Do you see how everyone here loves you?

The Administrator took time out of his busy schedule to address your concerns.

I, on the other hand, have nothing better to do right now . . .

So quit with the pessimism stuff, O.K.?

A pessimist, I was told, is someone who says, "Things couldn't be worse!"

The optimist says, "Yes they can!"

Alex

There are at least 2 Horologions in print that could be regarded as unabridged, the one from Holy Transfiguration and the one from St. Tikhon's. Both are pricey, and the St. Tikhon's one also has a service book for the priest seperately. I mention these 2 in case folks are reluctant to download, rework, etc. website Horologions. Either one will set you back over $60 as I recall, but are very extensive. They are most suitable for monastic use. The correct process for praying the Hours apparently varies by jurisdiction within Orthodoxy, but within a jurisdiction the best place to consult for correctness is apt to be a monastery, because so few outside the monasteries have made it their calling to pray the Hours. At HRM and in an OCA parish I have attended the priest just gives an occasional blessing or concludes the Lord's Prayer, both of which could be worked around. At HRM the Cantor prayed the Hours; at the OCA, a Reader. Same diff. We could sure use a Ruthenian Horologion in book form as detailed as the 2 I mentioned above.

David,

I will publish the short rule for Morning Prayer (maybe tonight if I have time).

When working with a spiritual father or mother, usually one lets that person determine how often and how long you need to meet. Once a spiritual director gets to know the person they are directing he or she is in a better place to make this type of determination.

The discernment of a monastic vocation is no different than the discernment of marriage or other life vocation. All of us are ordinary in this respect.

I�m glad to hear that you have identified a couple of possibilities. Keep trying!

Admin

Thanks Admin....

True, but we are treated as being different.

People keep asking or commenting behind my back, "Why throw your life away like that?"

Not many byzantines in this area and those that are will not function in this capacity because of my vocational discernment.

David

Dear Brother David,

In the venerable Ukrainian tradition, those wanting to become priests were often, and popularly, told: "Don't place a healthy head beneath the Gospel!"

I still here this saying in connection with other matters in common parlance.

But there are always people who don't understand the Monastic vocation.

They see poverty and chastity only in terms of "no money, no honey . . ."

Consider such to be temptations of the world that you are also being called to overcome with God's help.

Alex

David,

Your spiritual father or mother does not absolutely need to be Byzantine Catholic. If there are no possible Byzantine Catholics to serve in this role look for someone who is either Roman Catholic or Orthodox. Ask your pastor to help you identify a suitable person and keep asking until he does.

Admin