www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Please help with an apologetic question.

Dear Iliana,
Glory to Jesus Christ!

There are some good apologetic references to Jehova's Witness, along with Mormonism at Catholic Answers. Check out http://www.catholic.com/library/noncatholic_groups.asp

You may also try the EWTN document library search at http://www.ewtn.com/vlibrary/search.asp and use the keyword "jehova"

Hope this helps,
Deacon El

Everything is helping........THANK YOU

God Bless.

Better late than never! Thanks for Tammy for telling me about this thread. The folks here on the Forum are the best!

A great site by a Catholic on JWs is:

http://www.webshowplace.com/question/home.htm

JWs train vigorously in how to present their faith to outsiders. I was a JW for over 10 years and I know first hand how deceptive their theology can be. The JW at your door is very sincere. Just beware!

Unless you're willing to train yourself with the same intensity they do (they spend at least 2 hours a week in such training) I'd say not to accept their magazines or publications. The JWs give lip service to the belief that the Church Jesus established would not be overcome by the gates of Hades (Matt. 16). So, ask them:

"When did the JWs as a religion begin?"

They may give a few different answers. They may claim to be part of the original Christian Church. They may say that Abel (son of Adam and Eve) was the first `Witness.' They may even acknowledge the part played by Charles T Russell in the 1870s. Usually, they don't want to admit their more recent origins and will claim some connection with antiquity. If so, then ask:

"Can you show that there were people like JWs from the times of the Apostles till now?"

They may attempt to use the "Trail of Blood" arguments used by Protestants but these are easily refuted. The JW magazine "The Watchtower" has even spoken glowingly of Ignatius of Antioch and Irenaeus as if they were practically early Christian JWs! Have some quotations from these Church Fathers ready for them.

The JWs are not prepared to discuss such things and will quickly try to change the subject. Be nice to them but stick to the point. Jesus did not lie. He did establish His Church and it has continued till now. Despite the lies they may be told about that Church...Jesus' words are true.

On the Deity of Christ you can show them that the New Testament has no problem in identifying Christ with the Yahweh or Jehovah of the Old Testament. For example:

http://www.sthermans.ca/resources/tower/yahweh.html

A great little resource worth obtaining is the small book "Jesus of Nazareth--Who Is He?" by Arthur Wallis. It had a grewt impact on me in my spiritual journey. Wallis writes about the JWs belief about Jesus without naming them. He shows how the NT and the Gospels place Jesus on a Divine level and not on the level of a creature. I had a hard time finding it listed on line (perhaps it's going out of print?) but I did find it at this online source:

http://www.biblio.com/browse_books/title/j/1550.html

David Ignatius DTBrown@aol.com

I would also give a hearty recommendation it the websites David listed.

One more resource I would add is a booklet from Catholic Answers (www.catholic.com [catholic.com]) named "Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth"

I keep a few by the door for when Witness's come by.

They also have a Spanish version ( "Columna de Fuego, Columna de la Verdad" )

They are about a $1.00 a copy and well worth 10x the price.

If a former Catholic has really gone over, David's books are best. If a Catholic is falling to these folks, it's a great tool to reenforce Faith.

God Bless,

Brendan

The Watchtower Society is particularly venomous towards the Catholic Church

Revelation: It's grand climax

Scotus,

Don't be prepared to be sprayed with venom however. The Watchtower publications that are distributed to the public in recent years are much more polished and much less hate-filled than they were in years past. The Witnesses have become a kinder, gentler group of folks in that regard. I will give them the benefit of the doubt and presume that they have softened their stance (which is what they will tell you), rather than conclude that they have "gotten religion" and realized that hate is not a marketing tool that appeals to the masses.

These days, Witnesses as a whole are better educated than in years past (when education beyond high school was sometimes frowned upon). That and the intensive training they undergo, which always existed and which others have cited, can make them formidable opponents in a one-on-one theological argument.

Many years,

Neil

Dear Neil,

Yes, it is more than true that the JW's have become more refined over the years.

But this takes nothing away from the simplistic notions that surround their own theological presuppositions.

They score heavily on their well-researched (and twisted) views of Christianity.

But their Achilles' heel is always their inability to think critically about their own group.

Two days ago, I had a one-on-one with a Witness who simply approached me in the street as I was walking home.

He was a former Greek Orthodox Christian who insisted that the Orthodox Church is into "mind control" as it indoctrinates children into its faith from an early age without allowing them to question anything etc.

I found it quite easy to stop him in his tracks by focusing on the Jehovah's Witnesses themselves, their policy forbidding their members from reading anything having to do with religion except their own publications, their attitudes toward disfellowshipped members and the like.

When he handed me the "New World Bible," I looked at the beginning pages and pointed out to him the absence of any listing of the scholars involved in the translation etc.

Apparently, this was completely overlooked by this Witness of more than 15 years with an MBA degree.

I understand from a Greek Orthodox priest that he will be getting a fallen-away Orthodox Christian back soon . . .

The fact that JW's are better educated and the like and are still uncritically gullible with respect to such "religions" is perhaps related to the phenomenon of people in the upper echelons of NA society going for cult experiences and the needs these address for them in varying ways.

Alex

A good contrast between the teachings of the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Early Fathers can be seen at:

http://www.freeminds.org/doctrine/fathers.htm

It is written from a Protestant perspective and deals with the Deity of Christ and the soul after death.

These sort of information helped me when I first was thinking of leaving the JWs. It was the realization later after being involved with Protestantism for many years that these same Fathers also taught Apostolic Succession, the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, etc. that helped lead me to the Church.

David Ignatius DTBrown@aol.com

You are all the best. Thank you!

GOD BLESS YOU.

P.D. I will be going to Mexico for two weeks for the Holidays, my cousin tells me that in her little town (pueblo) the JW are working at it big time. I ordered the little pamphlets for a dollar and I will be taking them to her, she is willing to learn when I come over and to evangelize.

PRAISE THE LORD JESUS!

Well you know... the JW's and the Evangelical sects are one and the same, they're both the enemies of Christ and the enemies of the nation. It has always been part of the attack against the Christian faith and the nations evangelized by Apostolic Christianity.

Since the time of Juarez in the XIX century, after our Christian Emperor was killed by the masonic conspirators supported by Britain in 1867, the first act of Juarez' infamous regime was to transform the Catholic Church of La Merced into a Protestant temple. In New Mexico, 1847, the firt act byt "governour" Charles Bent was the apporval of a prebyterian centre.

The great capitalists have always know that as long as the countries in the West were traditional Catholic, or those in the East Orthodox, they could not dominate them. And these Protestant sects are the way people can be easily corrupted and their faith destroyed, so that they gradualy loose their love for the traditions and cultures.

At the time when the Ottoman Enpire became controled by freemassons, and later after Ata Turk, George Meyer who was in charge of "religious affairs" supported and sponsored Protestant sects in Greece.

There's nothing new under the sun.

There's a good broshure written by Catholic author Fr. Fabiano Amatulli about Protestantsm and the JW's attacks against the country, he's very nationalistic and very old fashioned Catholic Christian.

Iliana,

�Buena suerte a ti y buen viaje!

Despite the fact that my "handle" begins with JW, those are my initals, not to show any affiliations with the JWs, who are a relentless bunch.

I had a great aunt who converted to them. She was told that her entire family would convert. My greatgrandfather, who stowed away on a shop from Poland, almost threw her out of the house. They did not speak for decades.

I cannot add anything else to the advice that has been posted in this thread. JWs prey on uninformed and undereducated souls. the good folks here know what they are talking about, and I have learned much from them.

�Que tengas una Fiesta De Nuestra Se�ora De Guadelupe muy buena!

Vaya con Dios, Iliana.

I AM BACK!!!!! HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYONE AND GOD BLESS YOU ALL.

I had a great time in Mexico and in two different towns I was able to evangelize to my Catholic borthers and sister. They were very greatful for the literature that I took with me. The JW are taking souls bu the masses, even in the little pueblos (remote towns) and people are hungry for knowledge. A lot of this people are not as blessed as you and me to have the internet availiable, all they have is what the church gives them and with one priest for the whole pueblo things are not happening just yet.

Let me tell you, I had a little bit of a hard time with my husband while packing, I mean, a discussion, but at the end of our trip while in the airplain he said that he was proud of me. :p

This is a never ending learning so I continue with my studies and learning about this great Christian faith that Jesus established along with the Catholic faith. Thank you again.