www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West What church to choose?

I'm not Catholic yet (I want to be but I'm not sure what rite I want to be although I'm leaning towards Byzantine). But lets say I was confirmed in the Byzantine Ruthenian church. I'm a high school kid and if it was supposed to snow or sleet later in the day, my dad wouldn't let me go to the Byzantine Ruthenian church because of how far away it is. He might let me go to either a Greek Orthodox Church or a Roman Catholic Church because they are closer to where I live. Which one would you choose? I know that I should choose the Roman Catholic Church because I would be Catholic and not Orthodox, but would it be wrong to go to the Orthodox Church instead? Because their views and traditions are closer to to the Byzantine Ruthenians than are Roman Catholics. And also, what would be the chance of a Greek Orthodox priest allowing a Byzantine Catholic to receive the Eucharist since they are both of the Byzantine Rite? Is it likely? And have any of you asked a priest about doing this or about a different sacrament like confession?

And also, do Byzantine Catholics (especially of the Ruthenian rite) have Sunday obligation like Roman Catholics do? How about on feast days?

And sorry if this sounds kind of ignorant, I don't mean it to be. I just never heard answers to these questions and became curious, that's all. I personally would only attend a different church if I couldn't make it to the Byzantine Ruthenian church. And I would only receive a sacrament at an Orthodox church if I couldn't go to the Byzantine Catholic Church and if the priest allowed me to. And I never knew if Eastern Catholics had Sunday obligation or not so I was curious. Sorry again and Merry Christmas

searn77:

Christ is born!! Glorify Him!!

Welcome to the forum. You pose a number of areas for consideration and leave us with so many questions before answers could be given. To know how to move from Point "A" to Point "B" it's always bet to know what Point "A" is.

What is your starting point? What do you style yourself? Are you in a program of reception into the Catholic Church? If not, that's where you need to start. Many of the questions you ask can be addressed when you begin the Rite of Christian Initiation for Adults.

You mention you don't know which sui juris Church you want to enter. What is your basis for comparison? The different sui juris Churches within the Catholic Church have different liturgical and spiritual approaches to the same Mystery. Making a choice is not the same thing as selecting a new suit. Do you know a priest in either Church--the Ruthenian or Latin?

The Greek Orthodox Church is part of the Byzantine liturgical and spiritual tradition from the Apostolic era, just as the Ruthenian Church is. But, unfortunately, we are not in communion. That means that if you were to become a Catholic you would not be allowed to receive Holy Comunion in the Greek Orthodox Church. That is the regular discipline for both the Catholici and Orthodox Churches.

What do your parents have to say about this? Are they supportive of your pilgrimage--which, I assume, takes you away from the place where they are.

Your questions assume you would be much farther long in your spiritual journey than your first statement would indicate. Your questions will be answered as you move along in your journey to becoming Catholic. To answer your most basic question, however, let me say that you may move from one sui juris Church within the Catholic Church to another, but you cannot move outside it to receive the sacraments.

Merry Christmas,

BOB

I've been baptized in a Pentacostal church (and I'm pretty sure it's valid because the pastor said that he baptizes me "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost", but I'm not sure if I have a certificate of it or any document about it) and I'm not in RCIA. I thought that was for entry into the Roman Catholic Church. I know you can switch what rite you are by writing for permission to some sort of bishop or something in both rites(I'm not really sure who). A Roman Catholic priest suggested I take RCIA at his church and if later I wanted to change rites, it would most likely get approved if I do it for the right reasons because the Catholic Church wants to preserve these rites. Do they have different RCIA programs for different rites though? I thought it was just Roman Catholic? And also, I have been studying Catholicism loosely for about a year but in the past few months I have been heavily studying a lot which has been in the past few months.

I have communicated with the local Roman rite priest via email about questions I have about the rite. And I have been to about 5 masses and 2 Greek Orthodox divine liturgys when I still considered becoming either Orthodox or Catholic. And to be honest, I like the St. John Chrysostom divine liturgy better than the new mass. I plan on going to a Traditional Latin mass sometime in the neat future but my dad won't let me drive that far yet. I know that many but not all Eastern rites were Orthodox who later came into communion with the Pope. I have the Orthodox Study bible and have read The Orthodox Church that helps me get an Eastern perspective. I'm reading A Concise History of the Catholic Church that helps me gain a western perspective. On top of all of that, I have been studying articles and stuff online and praying a lot. And I know the basics about the differences in theology and liturgy, but I don't know that much. I looked at most of the stuff online that I could and I plan on buying some more books to dive further into the subjects.

From my understanding, Catholics allow Orthodox to receive communion at their churches. But I also heard that if a Catholic asks an Orthodox priest if he is allowed to receive communion at that priest's church, the priest could say yes. So I was just wondering if anyone has experienced this with the Eucharist or with any other sacrements. I'm not really sure on what can be done with the other sacrements like confession.

They are fine with it. My mom was raised up Roman Catholic and she turned away because she thought it was too ritualistic. My dad has been asking me questions about Catholicism and although I can't answer all of them, most of the ones he has asked me about I have been able to answer and if I can't, I research his answer so I can answer him back. I think through me becoming Catholic he might also later becomes one if he discovers what it really is and not what a typical person who doesn't know about Catholicism think it is. Like many people think Catholics worship saints and do empty repetitive rituals, which isn't true at all if you really research.

I'll have to look this up because I thought I read somewhere that if the Orthodox priest will allow you to, you can receive the Eucharist. I wasn't sure about some of the other sacraments though. I'll look it up though. Merry Christmas.

just wondering, how long does it take a message to appear on the forum? I wrote one on here about 2 1/2 hours ago and noticed that it's not up yet and that there are two new posts on another thread. I just wanted to make sure that my 2nd post (this would be my 3rd post) was sent. Thanks

Searn,

To answer your question about how long it takes for a message to post - posts by new members must be approved by a Moderator until we are assured that they are legit (not spammers or otherwise disruptive). Once they pass a set number of posts w/o issue, their messages appear immediately. How quickly one of those early posts receive approval is chiefly a function of whether a Mod is online to act on them. Given the date, the time lapse in your case is pretty easily understood - the late hour could also be a factor, but I'm usually on-line in the wee hours, so that isn't ordinarily an issue.

Welcome to the forum.

Many years,

Neil

I will try to answer your questions to the best of my ability, I was a former Director of Religious Education at a Roman Catholic Parish and RCIA fell under my umbrella, although I did not run the program. I do not know of an official program in the Ruthenian Church, but I would suggest meeting with the parish priest first. Which Parish/Eparchy are you located in?

As for the case of receiving the sacraments from the hands of an Orthodox priest, if it is a last resort and the priest is willing it is possible. For it to be a last resort there must be no Catholic priests in a reasonable area or it is a life or death situation. In your case you would be obligated to receive the sacraments from any local Catholic priest before the Orthodox priest. Intercommunion is not permitted because to share communion means to be one in the faith and it is clearly evident that we are not one in the faith otherwise we would be one.

All Catholics have a Sunday obligation and Holy Days of Obligation (Christmas, Theophany Jan 6, Ascension, Dormition and the Feast of Ss Peter and Paul). Our Simple and Solemn Feast Days are not obligatory although suggested and encouraged.

I hope these answers have helped you.

searn77:

The answer to your question was well put by Erie Byz. The Catholic bishops of the United States made the point some years ago that in most circumstances in this country there are no "dire circumstances" that would necessitate this practice.

I think that one of the first things you'll need to learn as a new Catholic or Orthodox Christian is that we don't "look things up" and go it alone. We have the tradition of having recourse with our questions to those given Apostolic authority over us. The Apostolic Churches, unlike those of the Reformation, are structured with a hierarchy, that is a structure of obedience. We defer to our clergy because they have been given the Divine authority to govern and interpret the Faith by ordination. The tendency in the Reformation communities is to "look it up," usually by referring to the Bible. We believe that true interpretation comes in and through Tradition, meaning the bishops who teach what the Church has always taught.

The Apostolic Churches practice "close communion," something foreign to the Protestant communities' tradition and practice. That means that except for very grave circumstances we don't go from one Church to another when receiving the Eucharist or other sacraments/mysteries. Communion means far more than the mere reception of the Mysteries that one does in church. There are many threads here that explore the other meanings that attach to Eucharistic reception.

You might add the Catechism of the Catholic Church to your collection as a starting point for understanding the Latin Church's take on what Catholics believe. There are also very good catechisms available from the Eastern Catholic Churches. My brethren here will be sending you titles as this thread continues.

In Christ,

BOB

Erie Byz writes:

I purchased the Catechism of the Catholic Church a few months ago and I have been studying from it, although I admit I haven't been able to study it as much as I would like to. And I didn't know Eastern Catholic Churches had their own catechisms, but I would definetly love to get one. And thanks a lot for everyone who has answered and helped me in this thread, I greatly appreciate it.

Seaurn77:

Check out www.theobooks.org [theobooks.org] - and work your way through the "God With Us" links on that page. There you should find the 3 "Light For Life" books which are a basic catechism of Eastern Catholic Churches. While you're placing your order there, go ahead and pick up the book "The Face of God" by Archbishop Joseph Raya. It's an excellent book on giving you an introduction into Eastern Catholic theology.

And, while you're searching - continue to ask questions, continue to read, continue to research!

In order to understand Eastern Christianity better, I recommend reading Fr. Meyendorff's book "Byzantine Theology." The link below is to an online version of the book (in excerpted form):

[u]Byzantine Theology: Historical Trends and Doctrinal Themes[/u] [holytrinitymission.org]

Thanks, I'll have to check out those books that you all have mentioned. I found online the complete texts of the first two of the three "Light for Life" books so I'll have to check them out. For Christmas I got a $25 gift card for Borders Books so I was looking online to see what Byzantine books they have. The three that caught my eye were "American Eastern Catholics" by Fred J. Saato (Borders gives a wrong summary for this book), "101 Questions and Answers on Eastern Catholic Churches" by Edward Faulk, and "Standing in God's Holy Fire: The Byzantine Tradition" by John Anthony McGuckin. Has anyone read these books and recommend or discourage them? Are there different books that are on Borders website priced under $25 ($25 has to be enough for the shipping and handling) that any of you would recommend or discourage? Thanks

Searn,

The third book you list may be a bit advanced for the stage at which you are, but the other two would serve you admirably. Both Father Fred (Saato) and Deacon Ed Faulk are clergy of the Eparchy of Newton of the Melkites, our US jurisdiction.

I've known Father Fred for many years. He was directly involved with the Eastern Catholic catechism series, as representative of our Eparchy and his book is regularly cited as an excellent introduction to the Eastern Churches. (You're right, the summary is absolutely unrelated to the book; I tried to message the company about it, using the contact form, but it keeps erroring out.)

Deacon Ed, author of "101 Questions" is a bi-ritual deacon, serving in both Latin and Melkite parishes. He is also both a member (posting as "Father Deacon Ed") and an administrator of this forum, as well as a good friend. I'd unreservedly highly recommend his book.

Many years,

Neil