The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
MarianLatino, Bosconian_Jin, MissionIn, Pater Patrick, EasternChristian
5,999 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 247 guests, and 41 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
St. Sharbel Maronite Mission El Paso
St. Sharbel Maronite Mission El Paso
by orthodoxsinner2, September 30
Holy Saturday from Kirkland Lake
Holy Saturday from Kirkland Lake
by Veronica.H, April 24
Byzantine Catholic Outreach of Iowa
Exterior of Holy Angels Byzantine Catholic Parish
Church of St Cyril of Turau & All Patron Saints of Belarus
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics35,398
Posts416,768
Members5,999
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#313896 02/28/09 02:30 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 571
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 571
Do any of you know if there are any Byzantine Catholic Reader's Service materials online. I can only find the Orthodox version of the Reader's Service through a search. I need texts for lay led Matins, Vespers and Typica for Lent that use the Ruthenian recension and are approved by ecclesiastical authority. I did not feel that it was right to just do a cut and past job and make my own using Father John Whiteford's texts as a model--

http://pages.prodigy.net/frjohnwhiteford/horologion.htm


Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,461
Likes: 1
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,461
Likes: 1
Unfortunately there is no similar "Reader's Horologion" amongst Greek Catholics.

There are, however, extant versions in English in use amongst UGCC, BCCA, and Melkite groups floating around of Vespers and Matins, Akathists, Hours, etc. without a priest.

The only texts that I know of that have actually been approved by a bishop without the celebration of a priest are several UGCC versions of Typika with Holy Communion from the Presanctified Gifts to be offered by a Deacon when a priest cannot be present.

I am sure several here can offer texts that are in use in their communities or missions. While Father John's texts are certainly very useful and a good place to start, there are some occasional differences between the Kyivan or Carpatho-Rusyn usage and the Muscovite usage that he uses as his model.

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 512
Likes: 1
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 512
Likes: 1
The "Reader's Service" is simply a modification of the regular services, for the fact that a priest and deacon are not present. That is, various short prayers are substitute for the priest's and deacon's responses.

I see no reason not to use your jurisdiction's existing texts, and just use the substituted prayers.

Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,882
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,882
Deacons do Reader Services if the Priest, or Bishop is not present.

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 571
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 571
Do I need to get the bishop's permission to hold a lay led service of typika or vespers for a group? would I have to get the permission of both Latin and Byzantine Eparchs since Latin Catholics may be attending? I am just going to use the ROCOR text until I get more liturgical documents to assist me. I was surprised our Church doesn't have a book for missions or something that is helpful for lay people doing services without a priest. Maybe, I just need to dig more.

Thank all of you for your help.

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 512
Likes: 1
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 512
Likes: 1
I'm no expert - I'm just a minimally informed layman. But...

...if it's purely private, I wouldn't imagine you'd need permission. However, if you were to pray in a parish you certainly would need the priest's permission. If you wanted to make this an official mission or somesuch, I'd definitely suggest you contact your bishop.

All the basic instructions are one the webpage - someone who knew how to do the services with a priest would be able to pray a reader's service easily with only those instructions.

The best shortcuts I can recommend are some of the compilation-books out there, as well as the recordings that are available of the services from diverse places. For instance, the Ukranians put out a book that has most/all the texts for vespers and Orthros compiled (does anyone have a link to them?). I can recommend some good recordings of the Greek/Arabic tradition. Unfortunately, I can't help with the various Slavic chant traditions.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 528
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 528
I wrote a readers vespers service using the MCI's info and the recommendations of a few priests. We plan to start doing them on weekdays in the next few weeks.

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,760
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,760
I ran across this old topic of Reader services. Most of the answers are now available in the Pittsburgh Archeparchy's cantor site.

Through the work of Cantor Jeff many of the answers to the above questions are provided in this link:

http://www.metropolitancantorinstitute.org/liturgy/ReaderServices.html

Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,328
Likes: 22
Moderator
Member
Offline
Moderator
Member
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,328
Likes: 22
It may need some updating as it has some divergences from every other Reader Service I have seen.


My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 639
Likes: 12
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 639
Likes: 12
Father Lance,

Are the divergences related to the prayers that are inserted, and the "Amen"s that are omited (along with the concluding doxology after the Our Father"? Otherwise this seems to be the order i have seen and generally followed. I wonder what the source for inserting these prayers is.

Adam

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 569
Likes: 2
E
Member
Offline
Member
E
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 569
Likes: 2
No doxologies, no vestments, no incense -- all for obvious reasons!

Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,328
Likes: 22
Moderator
Member
Offline
Moderator
Member
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,328
Likes: 22
Originally Posted by akemner
Father Lance,

Are the divergences related to the prayers that are inserted, and the "Amen"s that are omited (along with the concluding doxology after the Our Father"? Otherwise this seems to be the order i have seen and generally followed. I wonder what the source for inserting these prayers is.

Adam

Every Orthodox source I have seen allows censing with a hand censer at Psalm 140 at Vespers, the Polyeleos and 9th ode at Matins, and the Alleluiarion and of the Holy Gifts (if distributed) at Typica.

Nor is the specific prayer of the hour suppressed at the Little Hours. And yes the insertion of the Prayer of the Hours and the other Monastic Prayers at Vespers and Matins is our innovation. I also find it unusual that this is okay but ending the Our Father with the Jesus Prayer is too much.



My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 88
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 88
There's no such thing as a "Reader's service."

If a deacon is present, do they become "Deacon's services?"

If a priest, are they "Priest's services"?

No. They are ALL services of the Church, whether done with a priest or led by a lower clergyman.

They are NEVER called "reader's services" in women's monasteries.

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 569
Likes: 2
E
Member
Offline
Member
E
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 569
Likes: 2
Sorry, but at both our sister OCA Cathedral and our church when (rarely) a priest is absent, the services are called Deacon's Vespers. Now, I know that laymen burn incense in their cell-rule prayer, but to do offer incense publicly during the Church's Liturgical Prayer . . . who blesses the incense? Similarly, one puts on no vestment since there is no one present to bless it.

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 576
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 576
The OCA has a "readers service" for the use of military people. From what I have experienced these readers services are mostly popular with converts and not well received or understood by "ethnics" http://www.scoba.us/military/readers-service.html

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  theophan 

Link Copied to Clipboard
The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2024 (Forum 1998-2023). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5