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Why not use terms like 'orthodox' or 'heterodox?' Conservatism and Liberalism have nothing to do with dogmas or doctrine.

Any new dogma can be considered 'liberal' because it may change former understandings of faith as being something new while at the same time be totally 'orthodox' as the church's articulation of that faith. See where it can end up?

Joe

The big thing is this: if there is indeed a Holy
Spirit who is sent to guide the Church, then must we not both be open to newer understandings of God's community as well as be on guard against the idea that what was good in the 12th (or whatever century) might not be viable today?

The populist idea that "conservatism" means "immutability" is just not correct. Immutability, i.e., 'never changing' is an attribute that is ascribed to God, but cannot be ascribed to human affairs or reality. Humans change, perforce of grace and the Holy Spirit, and we are ever evolving towards the Omega point of the Father, Creator. To suggest otherwise is to propose that the Holy Spirit has no role in the evolution (yes, evolution) of humanity. And this is indeed in contradiction to what we understand to be the reality of human reality as related to the Holy Spirit.

I think that Brother JThur has exemplified this very clearly in his earlier posts. He has seen all sorts of things that were outside the pale of Christianity and Christian behavior, but nonetheless, he has continued, through the grace of the Holy Spirit, to serve the Church and her people. It is the grace of the Holy Spirit that has allowed him (and others) to continue to move forward.

Christ is Risen!!

Another of my attempts to Easternize this thread

Do you know that the Society of St Pius also has groups of Eastern Christians?

Not so long ago, some Greek Catholic priests in Ukraine organized themselves and formed a Society of St. Josaphat which is now under the omophor of the SSPX.

Somewhere I read that in Bulgaria some Orthodox priests also joined the SSPX.

It seems that the SSPX is quite like a Church in itself with its own tribunals and even Eastern Churches.

What impact would this have if there is a future reconcilliation?

Without being too unkind about these SSPX folks:

1: They are RCs who have a problem with the Roman Community and have chosen to distance themselves from it.

2: We are Byzantine Christians; our peoples have suffered a LOT because we totally believe that being in communion with the Bishop of Rome, the Holy Father, is critical in our salvation.

Why, in heaven's name, would someone propose that Byzantine Christians should be the refuge for the "loyal opposition" to the Holy Father?

Our traditions, our organic development from what our ancestors have believed and LIVED, and our firmness in our Christian faith may seem attractive to the "traditionalists" of the Roman Church.

But the reality is: They AIN'T us. We AIN'T them. And the idea of "hold on to the old stuff" is nowhere near enough for Byzantines to just buckle under and let these folks into our communities. Why? Because their "praestantia ritus latinorum" (=the Latin rite is numero uno) just doesn't fit well with our spirituality. And while we are more than welcoming to real seekers and pilgrims, we are not a sanctuary for those who reject the teachings of the Universal Church.

In this case, the old adage: "Grow where you are planted" makes supreme sense. We Byzantines are not some ecclesiastical "extra-territorial" embassy where folks can seek refuge. We have a lot of issues among our own that we need to resolve without in turn providing a debate class for the disenfranchised.

Christos Anesti! Christos Voskrese!