www.byzcath.org Forums Mysteries: The Life of Worship Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy The Revised Divine Liturgy Will the Revisionists Trash Church Slavonic?

Of course, everything about the "New Liturgy" is made a big secret by its perpetrators, but it just occurred to me that the introduction of the "New Liturgy" would be an ideal time for the Revisionists to jettison the Church Slavonic transliterations from our pew books.

"Oh, you're free to use Slavonic where you choose," the Revisionists will say, knowing fullwell that in two years it will all be gone from our Ruthenian churches, and that in a generation Slavonic will be cobwebs and dust.

Just watch... I bet these people do it.

There are seven other churches "of the True Faith" within twenty-five minutes of my home (two OCA, one Serbian, one Greek, one Macedonian-Bulgarian, one HOCNA and one Antiochean.) Unfortunately, no Russian churches. I'm checking them all out, to see which one gets my weekly "envelopes" after the Revisionists have their way and trash our Ruthenian Divine Liturgy. Others are beginning to talk about looking for the door, too.

Enjoy the Church Slavonic while it lasts.

Of all the other churches you mention, Pravoslavna, the only one I've seen use Church Slavonic is the Serb. If you visit the Serbs, you may find an almost total lack of congregational participation in the service, except for the choir and servers, however. Maybe the local parish is different.

As to pew books without Church Slavonic, there are already parishes that have English only booklets, without an authorized new book having been introduced. Some parishes have them to temporarily replace books that fell apart.

Dear Jim,

I am sorry to always intervene on this point, but just because a congregation doesn't sing, doesn't mean the people don't participate. Why am I uncomfortable with the way Ruthenians look down on other churches with other traditions?

I love congregational singing, but it is not the only way of participation. Sometimes, silence also speaks.

the unworthy,
Elias

Pravoslavna,

Out West, Church Slavonic has died out many years ago, long before the current revisions' appearance, thanks to Bishops and priests who seem to strongly dislike it. The responses often given is " no one knows Slavonic anymore" or "It's not a vernacular language". While both answers contain truth, the first response is a self fufulling condition since we have been admonished NOT to use Slavonic in the Liturgy. While it is true that Slavonic isn't a vernacular language, it hasn't been a vernacular language for hundreds of years. Similar arguments are used in the RCC regarding the use of Latin in liturgical celebration.

I grew up with Slavonic only liturgies being the norm. These days, my only opportunities for Slavonic liturgies is when I visit local OCA churches. Even then, Slavonic isn't used on a regular basis.

Steve

Dear Prav.

I was amazed at how much I was regularly asked for more "Church Slavonic" in the Divine Liturgy. And it was always much appreciated.

the unworthy,
Elias

Elias, point well taken. It need not necessarily be viewed as a failing. However, some Ruthenians expect congregational participation as a given, and are surprised when they don't find it. They may not necessarily look down their noses at a lack of it, though.

Dear Jim,

I am sorry to always intervene on this point, but just because a congregation doesn't sing, doesn't mean the people don't participate. Why am I uncomfortable with the way Ruthenians look down on other churches with other traditions?

I love congregational singing, but it is not the only way of participation. Sometimes, silence also speaks.

the unworthy,
Elias [/b][/QUOTE


The OCA church I've been attending has a choir and you also hear the people singing. It's a nice mix of both. I'm going to a different parish today for vespers, so we'll see how it goes there.

If you or a parish near you is using Lekvulic 1978, keep the current books for Slavonic services - BETTER YET, convince John or Jerry (or me!) to prepare a 32-page booklet with all the hymns of the Divine Liturgy in Slavonic, in several traditional musical settings. Then use that side by side with any new English books.

Honestly, many parishes would continue to use such an item, at least at Pascha and Nativity, and right now none of our books have decent music for the Slavonic. If you want new people to learn it, only hearing it occasionally, they could use some help.

Yours in Christ,
Jeff Mierzejewski

Some phonetic help with Slavonic would be helpful too.

Ask and you shall receive: Church Slavonic Pronunciation Guide (large) [metropolitancantorinstitute.org]

This is from the Metropolitan Cantor Institute's Church Slavonic [metropolitancantorinstitute.org] page, with much good material provided by Cantor Steve Puluka. (We are working on a Church Slavonic glossary / dictionary, as well as parallel Church Slavonic / English texts for the major liturgical services, according to the Ruthenian use.)

Yours in Christ,
Jeff Mierzejewski

Great. Thanks Steve and Jeff!

Now I need to learn the alphabet.

John, I found this site helpful when I was trying to learn.
http://www.learnslovak.com/index.php?pageID=3&lesson=1.

hope it helps!
-Katie g

Thanks Katie.

Does anyone know if any of our beautiful Carpatho-Rusyn hymns are online?

Sadly, in the Van Nuys Eparchy a previous movement already did away with Slavonic in the liturgy.
Our cathedral parish (Van Nuys, CA) still has the 1978 Levkulic books in the pews, however the liturgy pages were removed (ie torn out purposely) since it was thought at the time that Slavonic would never be used again liturgically in the Ruthenian Byzantine Catholic Church. It's amazing what drives these sorts of decisions.

This happened almost 15 years ago, before there was any hint of a change in revision and music as we are seeing debated so vigorously here. These were not the "Revisionists" in the sense that Pravoslavna writes of in his original post.

Steve

We are not Great Russian, but we use Slavonic. Usually about two hymns per week. Some hymns are almost always done in both. The kids are also taught some prayers in both English and Slavonic in Sunday School.