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For Immediate Release October 28, 2003 AGREED STATEMENT ON FILIOQUE ADOPTED BY NORTH AMERICAN ORTHODOX-CATHOLIC CONSULTATION The North American Orthodox-Catholic Theological Consultation concluded a four-year study of the Filioque on October 25, when it unanimously adopted an agreed text on this difficult question that has divided the two communions for many centuries. This important development took place at the 65th meeting of the Consultation, held at St. Paul's College in Washington, DC, under the joint chairmanship of Metropolitan Maximos of the Greek Orthodox Metropolis of Pittsburgh and Archbishop Pilarczyk of Cincinnati. The original version of the Creed most Christian churches accept as the standard expression of their faith dates from the First Council of Constantinople, in 381, and has been used by Orthodox Christians since that time. Towards the end, this Creed states that the Holy Spirit "proceeds from the Father." The word Filioque ("and the Son") was later added to the Latin version of this Creed used in the West, so that the phrase as most western Christians know it reads that the Holy Spirit "proceeds from the Father and the Son." This modification appeared in some areas of Western Europe as early as the 6th century but was accepted in Rome only in the 11th century. This change in the wording of the Creed and the underlying variations in understanding the origin and procession of the Holy Spirit within the Trinity have long been considered a church-dividing issue between Catholics and Orthodox. The Consultation had been studying this question since 1999 in the hope of eventually releasing an agreed statement. Entitled "The Filioque: A Church-Dividing Issue?", the ten-thousand word text has three major sections. The first, "The Holy Spirit in the Scriptures," summarizes references to the Spirit in both the Old and New Testaments. The more lengthy second section, "Historical Considerations," provides an overview of the origins of the two traditions concerning the eternal procession of the Spirit and the slow process by which the Filioque was added to the Creed in the West. It also shows how this question concerning Trinitarian theology became entwined with disputes regarding papal jurisdiction and primacy, and reviews recent developments in the Catholic Church which point to a greater awareness of the unique and normative character of the original Greek version of the Creed as an expression of the faith that unites the Orthodox East and Catholic West. The third section, "Theological Reflections," emphasizes our limited ability to speak of the inner life of God, points out that both sides of the debate have often caricatured the positions of the other, and lists areas in which the traditions agree. It then explores the differences that have developed regarding terminology, and identifies both theological and ecclesiological divergences that have arisen over the centuries. In a final section, the Consultation makes eight recommendations to the members and bishops of the two churches. It recommends that they "enter into a new and earnest dialogue concerning the origin and person of the Holy Spirit." It also proposes that in the future both Catholics and Orthodox "refrain from labeling as heretical the traditions of the other side" on this subject, and that the theologians of both traditions make a clearer distinction between the divinity of the Spirit, and the manner of the Spirit's origin, "which still awaits full and final ecumenical resolution." The text also urges theologians to distinguish, as far as possible, the theological issues concerning the origin of the Holy Spirit from ecclesiological issues, and suggests that attention be paid in the future to the status of councils of both our churches that took place after the seven ecumenical councils of the first millennium. And finally, in view of the fact that the Vatican has affirmed the "normative and irrevocable dogmatic value of the Creed of 381" in its original Greek version, the Consultation recommends that the Catholic Church use the same text (without the Filioque) "in making translations of that Creed for catechetical and liturgical use," and declare that the anathema pronounced by the Second Council of Lyons against those who deny that the Spirit proceeds eternally from the Father and the Son is no longer applicable. At this meeting the members also took time to review major developments in the lives of their churches. Among the items discussed were the seminar on Petrine Ministry that was held in the Vatican in May; the granting of autonomous status to the Antiochian Orthodox Christian Archdiocese of North America; the Orientale Lumen Conference held in Washington, DC, last June; the recent Patriarchal Assembly of the Maronite Catholic Church; the presence of a delegation from the Ecumenical Patriarchate in Rome in late June for the feast of Sts. Peter and Paul headed by Archbishop Demetrios of America; the seminar sponsored by Pro Oriente on the union of Transylvanian Orthodox with Rome in Cluj, Romania, last July; the Faith and Order response to Ut Unum Sint; statements by the two churches on same-sex marriages; and the recent meeting of the Joint Committee of Orthodox and Catholic Bishops in Baltimore. The 66th meeting of the Consultation is scheduled to take place from June 1 to 3, 2004, at Holy Cross Greek Orthodox School of Theology in Brookline, Massachusetts, and the 67th meeting from October 21 to 23, 2004. The North American Orthodox-Catholic Theological Consultation is sponsored jointly by the Standing Conference of Canonical Orthodox Bishops of the Americas (SCOBA), the Bishops* Committee for Ecumenical and Interreligious Affairs of the USCCB, and the Canadian Conference of Catholic Bishops. Since its establishment in 1965, the Consultation has now issued 22 agreed statements on various topics. All these texts are now available on the website of the US Catholic Conference at: http://www.usccb.org/seia/dialogues.htm In addition to the two co-chairmen, the Orthodox members of the Consultation include Father Thomas FitzGerald (Secretary), Archbishop Peter of New York, Father Nicholas Apostola, Prof. Susan Ashbrook Harvey, Father James Dutko, Prof. Paul Meyendorff, Father Alexander Golitzin, Father Emmanuel Gratsias, Dr. Robert Haddad, Father Paul Schnierla, Father Robert Stephanopoulos, and Bishop Dimitrios of Xanthos, General Secretary of SCOBA (staff). The additional Catholic members are Father Brian Daley, SJ (secretary), Msgr. Frederick McManus, Prof. Thomas Bird, Father Peter Galadza, Msgr. John D. Faris, Father John Galvin, Sister Jean Goulet, CSC, Father Sidney Griffith, ST, Father John Long, SJ, Father David Petras, Prof. Robin Darling Young, and Father Ronald Roberson, CSP (staff). Press release by the USCCB and SCOBA
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Slava Isusu Kristu,
Great minds think alike...
d
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It is important to keep in mind that this release does not have Magisterial authority.
I'm not saying I necessarily disagree with it--just remember that it lacks Magisterial authority (from the RC POV). All this commission can do is make suggestions.
LatinTrad
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Is the new document online yet?
David Ignatius DTBrown@aol.com
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I'm not saying I necessarily disagree with it--just remember that it lacks Magisterial authority (from the RC POV). All this commission can do is make suggestions. This dialogue and document are completely in line with the current magesterial positions as can be seen in Ut Unum Sint, Orientalium Ecclesiarum, Slavorum Apostoli, and Orientale Lumen. Official Roman observers and participants are present, and this is an official consultation between the RCs, OCs, and GCs. The Holy Father himself has said on numerous occasions the Divine Liturgy without the Filoque, and has stated his desire to resolve that issue. Let us pray for fruitful dialogue to restore unity rather than reminders of "limitations".
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Dear Diak, Yes, Sirree! And in the Vatican there are two copies of the Nicene Creed written in stone, one in Greek and one in Latin. Neither have the Filioque. When and if the RC Magisterium pronounces on the Filioque - I am willing to bet it won't be to announce that it is keeping it in the Creed. I'm thinking of developoing a T-Shirt with: No way - Filioque!  It will be made of papal colours, of course. Alex
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In the last (?) encyclical (?) from the Roman dicasteries of the Latin Church, "Domine Iesu", the Vatican published the Creed, sans "FILIOQUE"!
While not an official pronouncement per se, pretty darn close!
herb
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Dear Herb, They published it that way - and the sky didn't fall down? See, I told you so . . . I'll send you a t-shirt free of charge. Alex
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Originally posted by DTBrown:
Is the new document online yet?
David Ignatius DTBrown@aol.com You can find this at this site: http://www.geocities.com/trvalentine/orthodox/consult_agreed_statement.html This site is maintained by an Orthodox convert from Protestantism and here is his review on the document: I have not yet had the opportunity to thoroughly study the statement. The
following comments are preliminary.
What I find most interesting is that the 'Agreed Statement' is really an
agreement to disagree. Perhaps the fact that the group has been discussing
the Filioque for over four years without producing an 'Agreed Statement'
spurred them to produce something -- anything.
In part three, 'Theological Reflections', in the second section, 'The
Substantive Issues', the sub-section 'Theological', after presenting the two
differing viewpoints, concludes with:
: The Greek and Latin theological traditions
: clearly remain in some tension with each
: other on the fundamental issue of the
: Spirit's eternal origin as a distinct
: divine person. ... These differences,
: though subtle, are substantial, and the
: very weight of theological tradition
: behind both of them makes them all the
: more difficult to reconcile theologically
: with each other.
Similarly, in the 'Recommendations' part, there is the admission that 'the
Spirit's origin ... still awaits full and final ecumenical resolution'.
The introduction and the first two parts ('The Holy Spirit in the
Scriptures' and 'Historical Considerations') are generally unremarkable,
containing some debatable historical interpretations.
It is interesting that the 'Agreed Statement' acknowledges that the Synod
(Council) of Constantinople held in 879-880 is 'considered by some modern
Orthodox theologians to be ecumenical'.
It is unfortunate the 'Agreed Statement' refers to the East Romans as
'Byzantines'. It would have been better to avoid this term which is viewed
as pejorative by many Orthodox Christians.
Perhaps the use of 'Byzantine' should not be surprising given that the
statement reflects a academic mindset as demonstrated by its use of
'Pseudo-Dionysius' instead of 'Saint Dionysius'.
It is very disturbing to read:
: That we do, as Christians, profess our God,
: who is radically and indivisibly one, to be
: the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit
: - three 'persons' ...
It is difficult to find any justification for placing quotation marks around
'persons', thereby suggesting the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit might
not really be Persons -- terminology long-established and accepted by both
the Orthodox and the Latins.
It is odd that the paragraph (the first in the 'Theological Reflcetions'
section) which discusses God's self-revelation in the context of God being a
mystery transcending mind and reason would ignore the self-revelation
provided by the God-Man, the Lord Jesus Christ in John 15:26.
It is disturbing to see the claim
: It is also not true that mainstream Latin
: theology has traditionally begun its
: Trinitarian reflections from an abstract,
: unscriptural consideration of the divine
: substance ...
presented without supporting evidence since there is a great deal of
tangible evidence demonstrating that this is precisely what 'Latin theology'
has long done and this fact has long been recognised by both Orthodox
Christians and by members of the Vatican religion to be true.
The eight specific 'recommendations' with comments:
: that our Churches commit themselves to a new
: and earnest dialogue concerning the origin
: and person of the Holy Spirit, drawing on
: the Holy Scriptures and on the full riches
: of the theological traditions of both our
: Churches, and to looking for constructive
: ways of expressing what is central to our
: faith on this difficult issue
This is diplomacy-speak and has no substance.
: that all involved in such dialogue expressly
: recognize the limitations of our ability to
: make definitive assertions about the inner
: life of God
This has little substance and will be more of a challenge to the Vatican
religion than to Orthodoxy.
: that in the future, because of the progress
: in mutual understanding that has come about
: in recent decades, Orthodox and Catholics
: refrain from labeling as heretical the
: traditions of the other side on the subject
: of the procession of the Holy Spirit
This appears to be a call for peace, but it ignores the *fact* (also ignored
in the statement) that Orthodoxy has synodically condemned the Filioque as
heresy and has recognised the sanctity of those who, like St Mark Evgenikos
of Ephesus (proclaimed a 'pillar of Orthodoxy') have condemned the Filioque
as heresy.
: that Orthodox and Catholic theologians
: distinguish more clearly between the
: divinity and hypostatic identity of the
: Holy Spirit, which is a received dogma of
: our Churches, and the manner of the Spirit's
: origin, which still awaits full and final
: ecumenical resolution
The first part has little substance and will be more of a challenge to the
Vatican religion than to Orthodoxy. The second part is an admission that the
issue has not been resolved.
: that those engaged in dialogue on this
: issue distinguish, as far as possible,
: the theological issues of the origin of
: the Holy Spirit from the ecclesiological
: issues of primacy and doctrinal authority
: in the Church, even as we pursue both
: questions seriously together
This also appears to be a call for peace. Separating the issues as much as
possible is a sensible way to reduce complexities.
: that the theological dialogue between our
: Churches also give careful consideration
: to the status of later councils held in
: both our Churches after those seven
: generally received as ecumenical
Again, this is more of a challenge to the Vatican religion than to
Orthodoxy.
: that the Catholic Church, as a
: consequence of the normative and
: irrevocable dogmatic value of the Creed
: of 381, use the original Greek text alone
: in making translations of that Creed for
: catechetical and liturgical use
This is an interesting challenge to the Vatican religion. It suggests a
minimisation of _lex orandi, lex credendi_.
: that the Catholic Church, following a
: growing theological consensus, and in
: particular the statements made by Pope
: Paul VI, declare that the condemnation
: made at the Second Council of Lyons
: (1274) of those 'who presume to deny that
: the Holy Spirit proceeds eternally from
: the Father and the Son' is no longer
: applicable
A major challenge to the Vatican religion. Frankly, it seems impossible for
the Vatican to declare 'no longer applicable' something it has always
maintained was part of an 'ecumenical council' and therefore the teaching of
its infallible magisterium without undermining its claim to infallibility. elexeie
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As Incognitus has said elsewhere...consider the source. Anyone who can't refer to Catholics as "Catholic" but has to refer to them as part of "the Vatican religion" should not be taken seriously. The writer was a former Protestant and also a former Roman Catholic and Byzantine Catholic.
But, thanks for the link!
David Ignatius DTBrown@aol.com
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Perhaps those who are distressed at the thought of getting the interpolation out of the Creed might be consoled if they added "Sancte Filioque, ora pro nobis" to the Litany of the Saints? Incognitus
P.S. to Alex - put me down for a t-shirt, please (extra large)
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Dave wrote:
"As Incognitus has said elsewhere...consider the source. Anyone who can't refer to Catholics as "Catholic" but has to refer to them as part of "the Vatican religion" should not be taken seriously. The writer was a former Protestant and also a former Roman Catholic and Byzantine Catholic.
But, thanks for the link!
David Ignatius DTBrown@aol.com"
That's as good as the "convert" Orthodox priest who posts to an Orthodox list I belong to who calls the Catholic church the "RCRO."
"Roman Catholic Religious Organization."
Makes us sound like we're Jehovah's Witnesses. Don't ya love acronyms?
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Dear John, It makes me think of St Thomas More's words to William Roper, if you'll indulge me a moment: More: You need a clock. Roper: I can buy a clock, Sir Thomas. More: You know what I mean, Will. Two years ago you were an impassioned Churchman. Now you are an impassioned Lutheran. We must just pray that when your head stops turning, your face is to the front again . . . And I believe St Thomas More would join me in recommending that you, and all Catholics, stay off those Orthodox Convert Boards i.e. "Converts-R-us.nut" "I really would, if I were you" (Cromwell to Norfolk to ask More to attend the King's wedding to Ann Boleyn). Alex
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Alex,
we AGREE (I hear bells ringing and Te Deums and Slava Vishni Bogu being sung!) Many of the contributions on those Orthodox convert boards are not representative of mainstream Orthodoxy at all ( I don't think they claim to be either! :p
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The sad part is, the forum that I belong to isn't a "convert" forum. There are a couple of voices of reason, but most are not.
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