www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology No Progress with Vatican says SSPX

I am interested in the use of language and the holding of particular definations to define themselves. They refer to themselves as 'traditonal' Catholics, so what does that make most RC's from the Pope down to the least? This usage reminds me of how leftist organisations took over the term 'Progressive' to define themselves. I suppose the SSPX should know they dont hold any particular high ground here, as Rome is engaging with many other 'separated bretheren' as well as themselves simultaniously. Including other groups/churches who like the missal of Pius V.

Good point.

Also, I'm not too keen on the term "the TLM" since it implies that a novus ordo mass in Latin can't be "traditional". (As I mentioned earlier, I think we need greater availability of traditional novus ordo masses rather than greater availability of "TLM" masses.)

As far as SSPX being "traditional", I personally tend to think of them as "traditionalist".

-Peter.

I really don't care to discuss the problems with the present "Latin" Liturgy on a Eastern Forum...especially when the American/English translations do not reflect the Latin accurately...and that is a fact. So, if the translations are in error...

Again, it is noted,

"The one prefect of a Roman congregation who has faced up to the reality of the liturgical debacle is Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. He has no doubt that �the crisis in the Church that we are experiencing today is to a large extent due to the disintegration of the liturgy.� �What happened after the Council,� writes the Cardinal, �was something else entirely: in the place of the liturgy as the fruit of development came fabricated liturgy. We abandoned the organic, living process of growth and development over centuries, and replaced it, as in a manufacturing process, with a fabrication, a banal on-the-spot product.�

Who wants to worship the Lord with such a liturgy...is it in the spirit and truth ?

james

Just found this article courtesy of brother Shawn Tribe & Adoremus September Edition...

"Pope Benedict XVI and the Liturgical Reform"

http://www.adoremus.org/0906BenedictXVI.html

And please don't let my insane rambling stop discussions...I get a little crazy now & then...too much good expresso.

james

Indigo,

I didn't realize that part of my post had been deleted, and honestly I don't see why.

If you go back and read my post, I made it clear that I find it racist to imply that blacks are, by their very nature, people prone to jumping up and down and screaming and speaking in tongues, etc. in church. That is a TOTALLY racist thing to say.

The whole point of my post was to make clear that these are not real issues based on race, but only on racism. There's no intrinsic difference between the way whites and blacks worship, which is why I think it's rather uneducated to expect that blacks would prefer a Pentecostal church service to the Latin Mass!

How is that racist? I thought it just the opposite.

Logos Teen

Actually there are cultural differences to the way groups worship and to ignore that, to me, is racist.

Reading in some of these posts is very interesting. There are Blacks and Whites and i am just waiting to see someone write about the Coloureds, the Half Castes and other dark races. Racism is indeed deepy entrenched with some they dont even realise and monitor their own usage. The language used here so casually, shocked me I could not help but think I might be reading postings from some Dutch Reformed Church Africaaner from South Africa in the good ol'days.