www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Fr. Malachi Martin accusations...

Dear Dr. John,

Which craft were you making reference to?

I've often found it quite unbelievable that Catholics who define themselves as "Traditional" would want to attack the Papacy and the Church because of changes in liturgy that they feel are "heretical."

I'm not a theologian, as you know, (which is not necessarily a bad thing), but whenever I'm confronted with a doctrine or something the Church teaches that I'm not comfortable with (it happens), then I consider that the problem is with ME and not with the Church.

To want to attack the Church and tell it this and that is to fall prey to the prelest of Inner Light Piety, something the heretics of old were "infected" with (forgive my use of traditional Latin terminology here).

But I accept Tridentine Catholics along with NO Catholics.

They're all God's children, OXI?

Alex

Tridentine people who write these articles are sometimes influenced by fanatism, but they cannot be taken as mere anti-modernist criticisms.

Do you remember that famous phrase by Pope Paul VI about the smoke of Satan?
Massonic infiltration in the Ambrossian Bank and some cardinals who were closed to Paul VI (including Cardinal Villot as well as Annibale Bugnini) has already been brought to discussion and there are no clear proofs.
Anyway we cannot ignore that modern catholicism has been influenced by secular humanism, and neo-protestantism (new cathehesis, modern church architecture, modern liturgies are a good example of how the West has lost an important part of its religious identity).

These articles also relate this with the messages of Fatima (specially the third one, Albino Luciani, the Bishop dressed in white, martyred by his own brethen) and some prophecies about a future aposthasy in the Western Church ("Cardinals will fight against Cardinals, and Bishops against Bishop") and the modern church.

The problem of these articles is that they are not objective and some of them show a lot of Latin triunphalism (about Fatima, the Eastern Church) and a spirit of conspiracy.

Dear Remie,

As for the spirit of modernism, you've obviously never been to an Antiochian Orthodox parish .

This magazine is published by a priest who is at odds with his own Church that taught him about Fatima and about loyalty to the Pope.

Bob Orthoman, my very dear friend even though we don't ALWAYS agree on things (at least he has the decency to tell me off in public) would say that one wouldn't take an uncanonical group that broke away from Orthodoxy seriously.

So why do we take this group seriously?

Alex

Dear Esteemed Administrator/Moderator,

I would like to propose that this thread be closed down herewith.

It is something that will only produce negative fruit, of which I am all too painfully aware.

Alex

Awesome, and more awesome!

I agree with Alex. This thread is far from productive.

I will close by stating that Dr. John is wrong. There is a Great Pumpkin. And he appears only to those who have very sincere pumpkin patches.