www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Meeting our Metropolitan

Hey Everybody (but especially you liturgically and canonically knowing people)
It appears that I am to enjoy the honor of meeting my Metropolitan (Basil Schott-Ruthenian) and I would like to get some pointers on etiquette. I am excited to get to meet him and might well have some time to make a little conversation. So, some quetstion on my part
1) is "Your Eminence" the proper form of address?
2) does Metropolitan Archbishop Schott approve of hand kissing, etc.?
3) does anybody have a question they would like me to ask? (I have my own, but it never hurts to brainstorm a little).

This is an honor for me and I am looking forward to it!

BTW, this is going to happen in just under a week, so I would really appreciate a healthy discussion of this.
KH

Dear KH,
Glory to Jesus Christ!

I am glad you have an opportunity to meet Metropolitan Basil.

Your first greeting should be �Your Eminence, bless�.

Then you hold your hands crossed in front of him.
If he blesses your hands in any way, a kiss of his hand would be proper. It should not be an awkward moment either for him or for you.

For everything else in your conversation, you would precede each reply with the word �Archbishop� once. Such as: �Archbishop, it is good to meet you. Will you be with us very long today? Etc�

He is truly a �people person�. You should look forward to a pleasant exchange with him.

Good luck,
Deacon El

KH,

Archbishop Basil is immeninently friendly and down to earth. Your Eminence is proper as is Archbishop/Metropolitan Basil. He has no objection to hand kissing.

In Christ,
Fr. Deacon Lance

Thanks guys. This should be fun. Now, one other thing: is there any question anybody would like me to ask Metropolitan Basil? I myself, as I recall he is a Franciscan, intend to ask him something about that and about SFO among Byzantines. However, maybe somebody else might have an interesting/informative topic I might bring up. I don't think this is going to be a very long conversation, but the setting will be small group/intimate and it would be neat to have things to chat about that interest the Metropolitan and for which he could provide his unique insight.
KH

PS Could somebody please describe the manner in which I am to cross my hands: I have never been in this situation before and I would like not to commit a faux pas.

I have a question of my own:

Would "Your Beatitude" be proper? I guess this shows how completely out of the loop I've been lately, but I thought that "Your Eminence" was a strictly Latin term.

Logos Teen

Dear Logos Teen,
Glory to Jesus Christ!

I believe �Your Beatitude� would apply to a patriarch, and not to a metropolitan archbishop.
I suspect that rather than correct you, he would graciously proceed to whatever you asked.

Deacon El

P.S.- Be sure to include a written transcript of your conversation, so all of us can critique your dialogue!

The metropolia web site lists Met. Basil as "His Eminence"


Paul

Logoc Teen,

Actually yes it is. It is style proper to non -heir princes of the royal line, which is why cardinals and the prince grandmaster of the Knights of Malta were granted this style and it is regulated by several treaties. The title implies a diplomatic status and precedence that is accorded to cardinals and which Orthodox and non-cardinal Eastern Catholic Bishops simply do not have. All this said the Orthodox have adopted it for Non-patriarch heads of churches and the EP uses this style for the its metopolitans. The OCA metropolitan is styled as Eminence, so it seems we have chosen to follow suit.

My own opinion is that Beatitude would be more correct and proper for any hierarch who is the head of a church sui iuris regardless of rank. The Latin titular patriarchs (Lisbon, Venice, Goa) use this style when in fact they are nothing more than metropolitan archbishops. But I am only a deacon and my opinion and 50 cents won't even get you a cup of latte at Starbucks.

Fr. Deacon Lance

Brothers,
The discussion of title has been most edifying. I will use "Your Eminence" and/or "Archbishop (Basil)".

Now, I am still looking for possible conversation material and/or questions and I am still seeking a more precise description of my posture, hand placement, etc. when I first approach him.

Thanks to everybody for talking this through.
KH

Dear Fr. Deacon Lance,

Your depth of knowledge never ceases to amaze me! You truly are an asset to this forum.

Would an appearance on "Jeopardy" be in order?


Martin

Deacon Lance:

I understand that Metropolitan Herman (OCA) is addressed as "Your Beatitude." I have also been told that archbishops are addressed as "Your Eminence" and bishops as "Your Grace" in the OCA.

In Christ,

BOB

Dear Fr. Lance,

Metropolitan HERMAN is not "styled as Eminence" in the OCA.

He is called His Beatitude and is referred to as Most Blessed as he is the head of the Church. You may verify this here [oca.org] and here [oca.org] , this last page is titled "Biography of His Beatitude Metropolitan HERMAN.

A BC priest in Pittsburgh once expressed to me that the Ruthenian Metropolitan should be referred to as His Beatitude as he is the head of a sui juris Church. I don't know what Catholic protocol is on this.

Best wishes for the remainder of Philip's Fast,

Tony

Tony and Bob,

Thanks for the correction, I knew that too. I meant to put ACROD. I was wrong to state also that Orthodox use it for non-patriarch heads of Autocephalous all use Beatitude. Eminence seems used only by Metropolitans and Archbishops of the Ecumenical Patriarchate.

I assume we are following Metropolitan Nicholas because both Archbishop Stephen and Thomas used "Excellency" only with Metropolitan Judson did we start using "Eminence".

Catholic protocol is fuzzy.
The Latin Church is simple:
Pope=Holiness
Cardinal=Eminence
Patriarch=Beatitude
Archbishop and Bishop=Excellency

The Eastern Catholic CHurches have tended to follow suit but as in other things we should return to traditional Eastern usage. The problem is not everything used by the Orthodox in English is tradtional, Eminence being one. This is of Latin origin.

Pope Urban VIII granted this title to cardinals and the prince grandmaster of Malta and required all other princes who were using it to relinquish it and use the title Highness. This was later confirmed by the Congresses of Vienna and Berlin and the Treaty of Versailles and cardinals are granted the diplomatic protocol of princes of the royal blood, ranking behind only emperors, kings, and crown princes. This may seem silly to us in America but in Europe where monarchies still exist Orthodox and Eastern Catholic bishops who assume this title may be embarrased at some point. Imagine an auxillary bishop who assumed the title Holiness and you get the point.

Fr. Deacon Lance

Dear KH,

I'm thrilled that you are meeting Metropolitan Basil.

When I met our Metropolitan Archbishop, I addressed him in the Byzantine form (first name), "Archbishop Michael." He looked at me a bit surprised and said, "Have we met?. He was very cordial. When I was taking pictures of my daughter with him before her Confirmation, he gave me some tips on taking pictures. I treasure my meeting with him.

You will do fine in your meeting with Met. Basil.

Regards,

Paul

As to the Patriarchal Churches sui iuris

Armenian = His/Your Beatitude
Maronite = His/Your Beatitude
Melkite = His/Your Beatitude
Syriac = His/Your Beatitude

Chaldean = His/Your Holiness
Coptic = His/Your Holiness

As to the Major Archbishopric Churches sui iuris

Syro-Malabarese = His/Your Eminence
Ukrainian = His/Your Eminence
(affected by fact that both are also Cardinals)

As to the Metropolitan Arch-Episcopal/Arch-Eparchial Churches sui iuris:

Ethiopian = His/Your Excellency
Romanians = His/Your Excellency
Ruthenians = His/Your Eminence
Syro-Malankarese = His/Your Grace

When you get to the Episcopal Churches sui iuris, the presiding hierarchs are all of the Order of Bishop, but variously styled:

Abbott vere nullius dioecesis; Apostolic Administrator; Apostolic Exarch; Apostolic Visitator ad nutum Sanctae Sedis; Bishop; Eparch; and Vicar Apostolic.

As to all of them, the usage is His/Your Excellency, with the exception of:

the Abbott vere nullius dioecesis of the Exarchic Abbey and Territorial Monastery sui iuris of Santa Maria di Grottaferrata for the Byzantine Italo-Greek Catholics

and,

the Apostolic Visitator ad nutum Sanctae Sedis for the Byzantine Greek Catholics in Belarus

each of them is properly Reverend Archimandrite in speech (Most Reverend Father Archimandrite in writing).

Many years,

Neil