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This topic was discussed a while back on the Kliros, I though I would share some info I found out. The Antiochian Archdiocese requires Vesperal Liturgies for the twelve Great Feasts except if they fall on Sunday or Monday. On Christmas it is the option of the priest to serve in the afternoon rather than the evening hours. It also allows Evening Liturgies for the feasts of a dozen or so vigil rank saints. If an Evening Liturgy is celebrated, Litury is not celebrated on the morning on the Feast, excepting Christmas and Theophany. This has been in place since 1975. Some diocese of the OCA allow this practice as well at the discretion of the priest.

Fr. Deacon Lance

I�m not sure what the context of the conversation was, but I thought I would mention a few things.

I believe evening divine liturgies are allowed and not required in the AOA. Our liturgy for the Feast of the Annunciation this year for instance will not be in the evening but in the morning at our normal time. The Feast of the Annunciation this year falls on a Saturday, and we will have vespers on the forefeast on Friday night. I seem to recall many people from our mission regularly go to our mother parish for some feast days because they are able to hold a more regular cycle of the services up there. I will ask my priest if he has any further information on the Archdiocesan directives regarding the celebration of evening divine liturgies.

Regarding this accommodation, I am sympathetic to both sides. I can say our parish would have a very hard time getting the majority of parishioners on feast days that fall during the week if the liturgy was not held in the evening. That one I know can be argued back and forth. Our situation is somewhat peculiar as well in that our mission parish meets in a building that is in use during business hours and at various odd times. We had to scramble this year for instance to find an alternate location for your Holy Week services due to scheduling conflicts. Without the ability to hold evening divine liturgies, there are some feasts we might not be able to celebrate as a parish.

Also, personally I prefer to refer to these as evening divine liturgies, because they are different from the vesperal divine liturgies that we celebrate at other times such as Holy Saturday.

Andrew

I didn't know that the Antiochians were so Latinized!

They've taken in a lot of converts from Catholicism and the Protestant Churches, if this is true, perhaps that explains it?

Andrew,

The rubrics for Annunciation are different. If it falls during the Great Fast, and on Mon-Fri it is served as a Vesperal Liturgy of St. John. If on a Sat or Sun it is a normal morning Divine Liturgy of St. John.

I found the text with the rules here:
http://homepage.mac.com/gthurman/ib...dia/The%20Evening%20Divine%20Liturgy.pdf

The text does refer to Evening Divine Liturgy, however, that would be confusing for Catholics as evening Divine Liturgies are served now and they are just regular Divine Liurgy without Vespers. prefixed.

Fr. Deacon Lance

Yes, Nicholas, I am sure it was out of a desire to imitate the Latins and not pastoral concern that motivated this inexcusable innovation :rolleyes:

I'm not sure if Vesperal-Liturgies are mandated by the Antiochian Archdiocese, or just an option that has become the norm in most Antiochian parishes. I know that for me, as a full-time student, if the Antiochian church I attend during semesters didn't offer Vesperal Liturgies for feasts, I wouldn't be able to go to services.

Now, the order followed in the Antiochian Archdiocese for these Vesperal Liturgies is not the same as on Great Saturday, Christmas, Theophany, etc. Here's the basic rundown for those who like rubrical minutia:

Blessed is the Kingdom
Great Litany
Lamp-Lighting Psalms and Stichera (with repeats)
Gladsome Light
Troparia and Kontakion
Trisagion
(Optional: 3 O.T. Readings)
Prokeimenon, Epistle, Alleluia, Gospel and the rest as usual.

The differences between this order and the order for the other feasts is that Psalm 103 is not read, the festal Troparia and Kontakion are inserted, and the O.T. readings are displaced (or perhaps replaced?) to after the Trisagion.

Dave

Thanks, I wasn't aware of the distinction regarding this feast. Also, the pdf posted by Fr. Thurman does seem to imply the evening DL's are required.

Is that what the original conversation was about?

Andrew

For those without PDF:

Phase I
8/28 Nativity of the Theotokos
8/14 Elevation of the Holy Cross
11/21 Presentation of the Theotokos
12/25 Nativity of Our Lord
1/6 Theophany of Our Lord
2/2 Presentation of Our Lord
3/25 Annunciation
Ascension Thursday
8/6 Transfiguration of Our Lord
8/15 Dormition of the Theotokos

Phase II
11/8 Archangels Michael and Gabriel
11/14 St. Phillip the Apostle
12/6 St. Nicholas
12/20 St. Ignatius of Antioch
1/1 Circumcision of Our Lord and St. Basil the Great
1/17 St. Anthony the Great
1/30 The Three Holy Hierarchs
4/23 St. George
5/21 SS. Constantine and Helen
6/29 SS. Peter and Paul
7/20 St. Elias
8/29 Beheading of St. John the Baptist

Notes:
1. Phase I of Evening Divine Liturgy originally published in 1975. Phase II published in 1991
2. The Evening Divine Liturgy is to be celebrated on the evening preceding a Feast, i.e., the Liturgy for the Feast of Theophany is celebrated on the evening of 1/5. (The Priest�s Guide, p.5)
3. The Evening Divine Liturgy must be celebrated for all of the Feasts in Phase I, except the Feast of the Nativity of Our Lord. An evening Divine Liturgy may be celebrated earlier on the evening of 12/24, or Orthros and Divine Liturgy may be celebrated if scheduled late in the night of 12/24. (Priest�s Guide, P.5)
4. The Evening Divine Liturgy should be celebrated for the Patronal Feast of the local parish and for Feasts of Saints which have particular veneration in the community. (Priest�s Guide, P.6)
5. The Evening Divine Liturgy may not be celebrated for any Feast which fals on a Sunday or Monday, the Celebration of Great vespers is prescribed for Saturday Evening with Orthros and Divine Liturgy on Sunday Morning. (Priest�s Guide, P.6)
6. The celebrants at an Evening Divine Liturgy must be fully vested since this is a Eucharistic celebration. (Priest�s Guide, P.6)
7. Communicants at an Evening Divine Liturgy should begin the Eucharistic Fast following the mid-day meal. (Priest�s Guide, P.6)
8. There must be no additions or deletions from the approved texts of the Evening Divine Liturgy as prepared and published by the Archdiocese Department of Liturgics and Translations. The verses on �Lord I have cried� are especially to be rendered in full as they embody the specifically festal character of the service. Only the reading of the Old Testament lessons may be omitted at the discretion of the pastor. (Priets�s Guide, P.6

Structure of the Evening Divine Liturgy from the AOA website:

1. "Blessed is the Kingdom. . ."

2. Psalm 103(104)

3. Great Ektenia

4. "O Lord, I have cried. . .," in the proper tone
Glory and Now for the Feast.

5. Little Entrance with the Gospel

6. After the Little Entrance:
a. "O Gladsome Light. . ."
b. Troparion of the Feast
c. Troparion of the Patron Saint
d. Kontakion of the Feast

7. Trisagion Hymn

8. Epistle: of the Feast

9. Gospel: of the Feast

10. The rest of the Divine Liturgy

11. Megalynarion: of the Feast

12. Koinonikon (Communion Hymn): of the Feast

13. Instead of "We have seen the true light. . .," sing the Troparion of the Feast. (Only if it is one of the twelve great feasts.)

14. Dismissal: For the Feast

"Is that what the original conversation was about?"

No, just commenting Catholics might think you are talking about Liturgy without Vespers if they are simply refered to as Evening Liturgies.

Fr. Deacon Lance