www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Scripture and Patristic Writings Israel and the Temple

Originally posted by RayK:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Zenovia:
[b] To All:

Talking about the end times...better to leave it to our great (if not the greatest modern saint), Saint John of Kronstadt.

http://www.stvladimirs.ca/library/stjohn-kronstadt-vision.html



Very interesting symbols.

What years did he live? (I do not know anything about him).

Obviously he was Russian?

His dream - is centered around the fall of Christian Russia (Czarist monarchy) to the Bolshevik Revolution and the eventually fall of Bolshevic (Lenin) to real Communism (Stalin). What is very interesting (and bold) is that this vision displays the top hierarchy of the Russian Orthodox church - as capitulate and cooperate with atheistic forces. Christ is supplanted (within the Russian Orthodox Church) by the anti-Christ.

Under the regime of the anti-Christ � only those priest and religious who are sealed by the false prelate and his hierarchy � are allowed to live. While those who maintain the real faith of Christ are martyred. And the false church is complicit with that.

The �end of the world� spoken (of toward the end of the vision) is explicitly an end to the worldliness and anti-Christ - with a restoration of the real faith (to the Russian Orthodox hierarchy).

The dates are these�

1913-14 (Russia enters WWI which devastates Russian economy)
1917 (the Bolshevik Revolution called the �October Revolution�)
1922 (Lenin weakens and a much worse Stalin begins to rise)
1924 (the end of Bolshevik authority as Stalin has them all killed)
1934 (Stalin become the sole head of all Russia and Communism begins)

And so the narration is a chronology of the chain of events threading though these dates. The last date (1934 - Stalin style Communism begins) is not resolved. No new date is given. It is only promised � that there will be an end to the atheists who have taken over the altar of the Russian Church.

This vision (which I had not known about before) is a stunning- condemnation of the Patriarch of Moscow - as an anti-Christ - during the years of the Bolshevik and Communist powers. A testament that they were complicit with the death of good priests (not accepting their seals) in the gulags.

This seems to me (by the wording and symbols) a private revelation to John. A comfort that �these days will end�. Bit I am not sure if the end indicated was the end of the anti-Christ here on earth (within the Moscow church) or it is meant to indicate that it would end, for John, meaning his own death (John�s). It seems to me (at this time) that the end spoken of would be John�s own death.

What year did he die? (I just looked that up = 1908) even before all these things began to take place.

Therefore - the �end� spoken of is not John - but it is - the end of the anti-Christ occupying the chair of Moscow. I would have to re-read it to get a sense of ending events - but - I suspect that no indications are given. Leaving it to us to wonder if that chair is still occupied by an anti-Charist or if it has been returned to Christ yet.

Now before I get any flak from Russian Orthodox here... Hey!!! I didn�t write the vision - I am only telling you what the vision is about according to its own flow. It was obviously given to John as a preview of events (the rise of the five pointed star of Communism) within Russia and as regards the church. And note that the church is split - the common remaining faithfull and only the top becoming rotten.

Again... I don't write 'em - I only read 'em.

-ray [/b]

Originally posted by Slavipodvizhnik:
Welcome to ROCOR Ray!!!!!

Originally posted by RayK:
[QUOTE]

Do you want me to go over John�s vision inch by inch? Or do you already understand it well enough?

-ray

Originally posted by RayK:
Daer Slavipodvizhnik:

So... what will happen under reconciliation?

Does the ROCOR then ... submit to the Patriarch of Moscow?

Is it reunion or reconciliation (where both remain serperate but coopperative)?

Just asking.

-ray

Originally posted by ebed melech:

Quote

Originally posted by Zenovia:
[b] Dear All,

I have a problem with the mockery of these end time theories, and especially of the altar calls of the Baptists and other Evangelicals. ...I don't think we should mock them, but rather be thankful that they exist and because of them, we have not as yet fallen completely into the athieistic and agnostic state existing in most of the post Christian lands.

Zenovia

Zenovia,

Let me clarify my intention in telling the story. I shared that not to mock the practice of altar calls, but rather the idea of:

1. having an altar call at a prom
2. showing end time movies at a prom

Of course, the literalistic interpretations of Revelation as portrayed in the movie are laughable, with or without the lumberjack and his handy map.

By and large, I have great respect for the evangelical community and for some of their biblical theology. I count many evangelicals among my friends and family, but very few hold to the nonsense of 6 foot locusts. Actually, not all of evangelicalism is dispensationalist. There is quite the difference between the biblical schools of thought at say a Bob Jones University, Dallas Theological Seminary or Liberty University and say a Fuller Seminary, Gordon-Conwell Seminary or Trinity Evangelical. I find myself as a Catholic far more closely allied with the latter, rather than the former.

Gordo [/b]