www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Byzantine Seminary

[ 09-09-2002: Message edited by: J Thur ]

Slava Isusu Christu


Dear Stuart,

You make some excellent points. Yes there are parishes without schools, and some byzantine Catholic schools may be out of reach for a lot of parents. But with computers and the internet this is easily correctible. I believe there is a program called Catholic Home Scooling. Why not Byzantine Catholic home schooling?

Second, I am a graduate of a Ukranian Catholic School. The now defunct St. Nicholas Ukranian Catholic School to be exact. Maybe a right way of thinking
(orthodox, get the religious pun!) byzantine teacher can correct this.

Slava Isusu Christu!

Steven, there are quite a few Eastern Catholics who home school. We have done it with our sons since the beginning of their school days. The Ukrainian Catholic married priest in Wichita home schools his daughter. The Bulgarian Orthodox priest the next town over from us home schools as well.

There are some "canned" curricula but we have put together our own material over the years from a variety of sources, mostly Orthodox.

Fr. Jack, bless! Your post adds another dimension to the situation, with the additional students. But there still seems to be a reality that are only a few that are definitely in as priest-track with a lot of maybes in the wings.

The more I look at the success of St. Vlad's the more I think we should look hard at a unified cross-jurisdictional Eastern Catholic seminary approach. They accept all SCOBA jurisdictions for formation to the diaconate or priesthood. Just my $.02 (U.S.) worth.

[ 09-09-2002: Message edited by: J Thur ]

Fr. Custer,

Perhaps you should do articles from time to time on whats going on at the Seminary for the all the Eparchial newspapers. A higher profile might be of some benefit.I hear & read very little about the Seminary it's usually not that good.Articles that introduce the seminarians & deacons,talk about whats going on especially what you would like to do in the future.The laity might take a deeper interest in prayer for the seminary and its future, also a greater interest financially. I still believe though some type of "satellite classes" would benefit the Metropolia.


Nicky's Baba

Greetings All,

I have been away for a few days, and just now have got caught up on this discussion.

I have to disagree with the deacon training model for the education of priests. Not that a priest is different from the deacon spiritually or anything like that, but the priest is called to be the spiritual leader of the parish. In order for one to accomplish that, one has to be grounded in the spiritual life. One needs to be surrounded by the spiritual life. One also needs the best academic preparation that we can have. The people that we serve deserve the best prepared men that the church can put forward.

I have a BS in business, and five years of teaching experience. I do not feel that I can go a program that meets for a few weeks in the summer, and do some reading on my own and then get ordained.

The seminary program is not the best. Yes we only have a few men in the seminary. That does not mean that we need to close the thing or change the whole process.

The probelm seems to me that if a guy cannot commit to four or five years or study in a seminary, then perhaps we need to look at his commitment to the priesthood. Seminary is not easy, and it should not be easy. Priesthood is not easy, peoples lives are not easy.

We need to focus on getting more men to say yes, I will do whatever I need to do to serve God and His church. ARe we doing all we can? Are we praying everyday and night for vocations? Are we talking to people that we think would be good priests? If we are not doing all of this stuff, then we are not doing our job. Fighting about what the bishops should do and what the have not done will not move us forward.

This year, here in Boston, there were only five new seminarians for the entire Archdiocese of Boston. 2.5 million people in the archdiocese and all they could come up with was five people.

How happy is your priest? Does he make others want to do what he does?

Stop talking about what it was like 20 years ago. That was 20 years ago, and will never be now. If we ever hope to move on, and grow, then we need to look forward and not look back.

I have another question. How many resident seminarians can the building hold at Sss. Cyrill and Methodius?

If it can hold 100, then lets all start asking God to send us 100 seminarians. Another QUestion I have is this. Is the seminary a Ruthenian (sp?) seminary or is it Byzantine. I know how sposors it, but another poster said that there will be a Ruthian (sp?) seminary there when these men graduate from college. I am not Rutheian, I am Romanian. We need to start looking across the lines.

Now I have to dash off to prayer, so lets get very possitive, and if you have to be negative, then I would ancourage you to not post, as I need, and want to remain very positive.

Peter

[ 09-09-2002: Message edited by: J Thur ]

Three cheers Br. Peter! For inviting us to be positive when it is so easy to be negative. For saying from YOUR side of the formation process what I firmly believe from MY side: slow immersion is essential to the way theology should be studied and the spiritual life of priesthood should be explored.

Ss. Cyril and Methodius once held 110 seminarians (there was a war on then. . .). I would imagine the place could accommodate 40 resident seminarians quite comfortably by today's standards. Of course, with such numbers, we'd probably be back to having a waiting list to use our vintage, totally manual, circa 1950 bowling alleys!

Br. Peter raises an excellent point about the discussion of Ss Cyril and Methodius or of any seminary. Let's not forget the seminarians themselves, their generous commitment and their determination to make their years of formation fruitful. Energy would be better spent in talking about how to build up the place where our three fine seminarians have invested themselves than in speculating how soon the padlock will be on the door. Priesthood candidates deserve that much positive support and sense of security from us all.

Dear Brother Peter,

We can pray to God all we want to send us a hundred seminarians, but the fact is, God works through US. The belief that vocations are like meteors that come down from heaven and smack people on the head is misleading and somewhat dangerous. It puts me in mind of the story about the very religious man who lived on a flood plain.

One day, it started to pour, and the river started rising, and an evacuation notice went out to the people living by the river. The Sheriff knocked on the man's door and told him he ought to leave. "No, thank you", the man replied. God will look out for me". So the Sheriff left him in his house. A while later, the water was running in the street, and a National Guardsman in a jeep came by, and told the man to get in and be taken to high ground. "No, I'll stay here. God will watch over me". So the jeep went on its way. A while later, the water was so deep that it was lapping at the top of his porch. A couple of guys in a boat came down the street, and offered to take the man to safety. "No, thanks. I'll stay here. God will look out for me". And so the boat went on its way. The water continued to rise, and the man retreated to his roof. A helicopter came by and hovered overhead. Through a loudspeaker, the pilot offered to drop a line and haul the man to safety. Again the man refused: "God will provide", he shouted up at the helo, which then flew away. Finally, a huge wall of water came down the valley and washed his house off its foundations. The man was swept into the flood and began to drown. In his last conscious moments, he cried out in dispair, "My God, why did you forget me?" And he hears the voice of God respond, "What do you mean? First I sent the Sherrif, then I sent a jeep, then I sent a boat and finally I sent a helicopter. What more do you want?"

We're like the guy on the roof, thinking that God will provide. So He will, but He expects us to do our part. Prayer is part of it, but so is talent spotting, and encouragement, and emotional and financial support. We should be noting the men in the parishes who would make good priests, we should tell them they would make good priests. We should nag them about becoming priests. We should demand that they become priests, we should support them when they go to be trained as priests. After all, the priest is the perfect layman, who is called from his community to serve the community. The community is therefore obligated to identify and call forth those whom it wants to serve it. Waiting around for God to provide ignores all the men whom God has provided, whom we do not bother notice.

Br. Peter,

Spoken like a true monastic. However, there are many forms of spiritual life and not all are within a monastery or seminary. One can be grounded and surrounded and never set foot in either. I also disagree with you and think a format like our deacon progam could be used to train married presbyteral candidates. The most important factor is the quality of the candidates and the formation they receive not the format their formation follows.

In Christ,
Lance, deacon candidate

[ 09-09-2002: Message edited by: Lance ]

As John Chrysostom said, "There can be as much holiness within the bonds of marriage as within the monk's cell."

Dear Stuart,

I've often wondered if the monastic life would have provoked me to prayer as much as my wife does . . .

A great lady, by the way!

Alex

Dear friend, Alex,

I've often wondered if married life would have provoked me to prayer, as much as community life does...

...a wonderful community, by the way.

Elias

Bless me a sinner, Venerable Father in Carmel!

Who was it who said that the study of the lives of the saints is great for those who invoke them as well as for those who provoke them . . .

The Celtic monastics actually had the option to be married.

The name "MacNab" means "Son of the Abbot."

No wonder they prayed for as long as they did . . .

I thank you, Venerable Father, for all your kind guidance and prayers that have helped me so much.

May God bless you and guide you always, Servant of our Lord, God and Saviour, Jesus Christ!

Kissing your right hand, I again implore your blessing,

Alex

<<<<Of course, with such numbers, we'd probably be back to having a waiting list to use our vintage, totally manual, circa 1950 bowling alleys!>>>>

You really have these things at the seminary. That is so cool. I have t ocome down there and see this for myself.

I am not saying that for some people there could not be other ways to prepare for the seminary. For example, in Boston there is another Latin seminary for older guys. We who are in our older years do like to term delayed vocation, perhaps second career is more like it. Yea, I like that better, second career, or perhaps third, forth career.

Anyway, their formation program is much different then ours here. Well I should say the other Latin guys as I just live here and take my classes at the local Orthodox Seminary.

After I posted my last message, and signed off, I got to thinking of another persepctive on all of this. If we do not have an educated clergy, and I mean Master's Degree and all, then the theologians in Rome, and for that matter the other Bishops here in the US will have no use for us. Regardless of what we want to feel, we are part of the church here in the US that means that our Bishops attend the bishops meetings. We need to be able to speak inteligently. We are training the future of our church, we need pastors, YES, but we also need theologians, teachers, and real good preachers. I do not think that one can be a theologian, and speak with any kind of educated thought, without the education.

To the deacons on the list. I did not mean that your program was substandard in anyway. Please forgive me if you thought that is what I meant. I have much respect for deacons, and I also think that it is the best kept secret in the church. We need more guys like you.

If a man, married or single is not free of debt, then perhaps the priesthood is not the place for him. There is nothing worse then worrying about money when your trying to study. I know that sounds harsh, but if you cannot afford to study, or have the time, or be free of commitments, or have a wife that understands, then maybe your not being called to the priesthood.

It costs about $10,000 per year for a seminary education. SO we are looking at about $40,000 per candidate, and that does not include things like, food, room, books, insurance, transportaion, and don;t foget money for bowling.

I agree that we are in a crisis, but I also don;t think that just because a guy says he is called to the priesthood means he should be a priest. It took me four years to get here.

Trying to stay possitive,

Peter