www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall ANIMAL ICONS?!?

http://www.episcopalchurch.org/episcopal_artists_17638_ENG_HTM.htm

I like animals as much as the next person, but I absolutely refuse to venerate them. This is blasphemous!

Gaudior, now subsiding to go eat some chocolate and recover from the shock

As an iconographer, this simply disgusts me. Those saints did a whole heck of a darned lot to get those halos and those portraits. Getting an icon actually means something. And this woman has attempted to destroy that. Thank God the Episcopal Church is dying out, otherwise I'd be truly worried.

Obviously this woman needs prayers, prayers that I'll be happy to offer.

This is absoultely insane! Oh the bizarre things that come out of ECUSA these days!

Jason a sinner

So you do not like the icon of St. Calico, St. Corgi, and St. Labrador? Yes, sorry this is bad. I should not have looked but I was curious.

I will do penance for this post.

Michael

Those arent going to be put in a church are they?

LOL: Myles, you have the gift of droll understatement !

I didn't see St. Bernard in there ...

What is disgrace! Obviously this woman does not understand the true meaning of icons.

(PS - My dog passed away last night. Now my best friend is gone . Whenever I would get her food ready to feed her or when I would get out her leash, she would do a dance for joy, turning circles in the air. Now I'm sure she is having the same reaction in heaven. She was such a good dog, even saving my life once. HOWEVER, I would never paint an icon of her.)

Yes, I ran across this clown on the internet when I was googling "iconography" some time ago; I use it as an example of how bad things can get when you depart from tradition when I teach.
Hey, if all creation is sacred in the sense that she means it [for it is true that all creation is in some sense sacred] why stop with the animal kingdom; why not icons of rocks and gasses and insects and worms? Hmm?
-Daniel

Deepest sympathies on the loss of your little friend, Rose2!

Gaudior!!!!

:rolleyes:

Alice, who notes that the artist is of Greek background and Orthodoxy...

(All: please don't stone me because of that! )

I actually had a good laugh at the animal icons.

I don't like cats at all and seeing one with a halo was pretty funny to me.

She is just misguided. That's all.

Hi UkrainianCatholic,

I actually found them a bit amusing as I didn't think of them as 'sacred' in any way (barring St. Bernard--JUST kidding)....
I see where they could be considered blasphemous...
My husband thought they were "ridiculous"...
I guess that it is all in how you look at them! :rolleyes:

Alice

Well ... what can you expect from a church body that produced the likes of Bishop Spong?!?!

While it is rather odd, we must remember that there is some truth in the notion and it is worthwhile to discuss some of it. We should not entirely dismiss the idea (we have icons with animals in them, from Adam naming the animals, to Jonah and the Whale).

What is an icon? It's a window into heaven (among many other aspects associated with them). While it probably is inappropriate to make "Saint Oscar" from one's dead dog, there can be some theological ground for it: if we believe that all of creation is restored in Christ, and from the prophecies of scripture that this will include animals (the lion shall lay with the lamb) then, if one truly believes an animal is somehow restored in Christ and experiencing God in heaven, can they find a way to express it? Is this not also the justification for making icons of people who have not been officially canonized?

There are a few historical animals I would even say we can use to confirm this notion and I would not find it inappropriate to make icons of them. The best example of this to me is Brother Wolf (from the life of St Francis). The whole story calls for the wolf somehow being transformed by contact with Francis, even becoming rational (able to bargain and come into a covenant relationship). Indeed people visited the relics of Brother Wolf for centuries, and I think his skeleton is still used for pilgrimages in Italy.

So, while it seems odd, there seems to be a sacramental, even incarnational view at work, one which in fact remembers the cosmic signifance of Christ. Is it heretical? Indeed, it might even be able to be used to show us that God is at work in the whole of creation, that animals can be spirit-bearers (something many of us forget, despite the whole story of Balaam's ass)