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Since today is the Feast of the Entry of the Most Holy Mother of God into the Temple, do Byzantine Christians feast or fast?

If you're following the traditional discipline of fasting, you would normally have a fast and strict abstinence (Friday, and during the Christmas fast).

However, since 21 November is a feast of the second class, you do not fast, and the abstinence is mitigated to allow you to eat fish and food cooked in oil, and to consume wine.

Matta,

What about dairy on 21 November?

According to my calendar, dairy is out. Only fish, wine, and oil. Looking through the month of December, I don't see any days where dairy is allowed.

Joe

Milk, cheese, and dairy products are a level lighter in fasting discipline than fish.
So if the typikon or rubrics specify that fish may be eaten, it implies everything below (wine and oil), but does not include anything above (milk, cheese, dairy products; meat and meat products).

Even a first class feast during a fasting period (e.g. 6 August) only lightens the abstinence to the level of fish.

The only where one abstains only to the level of milk, cheese, and dairy--i.e., one only abstains from meat and meat products--is during Cheesefare week. (Next occurence: 16-22 February 2009.

So lowest to highest would be:

oil and wine
fish
dairy
meat

Is that right?

Correct.
Although: (i) the dairy is only used during Cheesefare week; and (ii) Great & Holy Saturday permits a glass of wine (but not oil) after the celebration of "Saturday of the Light" (late morning, finishing around midday).

Let's be careful with following calendars.

They are obliged to put the original 'fast' from yester-century (don't know if that is actually a word--I kind of made it up), and parts of the world where such foods (ie: shellfish, legumes, etc.) were readily available and cheap....

Today's approach is rarely oil free on all the days of a fast...even at monasteries.

Also, certain foods are allowed if there is difficulty following such a strict fast...but this is between a person and his spiritual father.

Alice

ALICE:

Christ is in our midst!! He is and always will be!!

You've stated the case for fasting quite well with this.

When I was in university in central PA some 35+ years aog, it was almost impossible to obtain shellfish or other fasting items either fresh or frozen. The Orthodox people I knew then ate fish all during the fasting periods witht he exception of Wednesday or Friday. They explained that they'd kept the first week and last week of Great Lent as strictly as they could but otherwise would have endangered their health because protein sources just weren't available. I never remember soy products being available here until about 10 years ago, for example. There were a lot of pierogies eaten as well as lots of traditional Slavic foods.

One of the women who was at university with me tried to keep a strict fast while eating int he dorm cafeteria, but nearly collapsed after about three weeks because there was so little that she could eat and still keep the fast strictly. Her pastor was not at all happy because she'd done this on her own without consulting him and advising him of her situation.

There was one other rule that an Orthodox priest once mentioned to me that he said was one of the most important. In the case of one being the guest of a person who either does not fast or knows nothing of Orthodox fasting rules, one learns not to mention one's fast if it would cause one's host embarrassment. As one of the Desert Fathers said,



I will say I was impressed and humbled with the people in the parishes in that they did prepare for Presanctified Liturgy every Wednesday and Friday, fasting from the previous midnight to receive in the evenings at 6 or 7 p.m., depending on the parish. They also made the effort to attend the DL every Saturday morning, too, in addition to well-attended Vestpers and Sunday DL all year long.

As you say, keeping a Mediterranean diet in this country can be very difficult and any fast needs to be done under the direction of one's spiritual father.

In Christ,

BOB

Dear brother in Christ, Bob,

Christ is in our midst!


WOW! In Greek churches, we are advised to not eat after noon- one p.m. lunch for presanctified!


I remember a time that I did this truly and humbly in order to not insult someone. At a small privately owned retail environment I once worked at, we always brought in our own lunches and ate at separate times, which made it easy to fast and not be obvious about it. It was one of the first years I was attempting to fast from meat for the whole of Lent. One particular day, my manager, who was a Belarusian Jew, was in a particularly happy mood because his wife (who generally worked long hours and came home late) had been off the day before and cooked one of his favorite Slavic meat recipes. He brought in the leftovers and was like a little boy offering me some to taste. He was so happy and proud to offer me some. I had realized that the people I worked with, and for, being from the former Soviet Union, where food was scarce and old time values of hospitality were still adhered to, considered their offering of food (and drink) as great honour to another, and were offended and hurt if it was refused. So, I just accepted graciously, ate it (without really enjoying it because I was not in the mindset of savouring meat) and complimented his wife on her delicious recipe...and then I quickly forgot about it, without guilt.

I knew, and I actually felt, that, in that particular situation, what I had done was a good and holy thing, and was in the spirit of what the Fathers teach.

On the other hand, when I was once invited to a dinner dance on a Friday at a big hotel, and ate the meat dish they offered, I did feel guilty. I did not want to bring my fast to the attention of the others at the table, by leaving a whole plate of food (which was paid for), untouched. It would have seemed strange and definitely brought much attention to me. On the other hand, there was no real 'host' that prepared it and would have been offended or hurt...(other than the hotel's chef). This has happened to me twice. Perhaps if there is ever a next time, we should call in advance and ask if we could possibly be served a fish dinner instead?!?

Alice