www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Confession in Russian churches

At the Russian churches I have attended, I noticed that people have a quick confession with the priest before services.

Is this required every Sunday/Divine Liturgy, or every Sunday/Divine Liturgy where one will be receiving communion?

As an Orthodox of another tradition where such frequent confession is not practiced, if I have had confession, let's say-a month before, I am assuming that it would not be appropriate to receive Holy Communion in the guest church, since that priest does not know my spiritual life.

Alice

Every Sunday where one will be receiving communion--this has been the experience of one of my good friends.



Probably not in that Russian church, but I have received Holy Communion in other kinds of parishes (Antiochian, OCA (Albanian and Romanian) to be exact) without having to go to Confession. "Are you Orthodox?" "Yes." --and that's that.

ALICE:

I've attended OCA parishes many years ago and recently. Many years ago, confession was required each time one was to receive. I have seen the practice of giving absolution to people who have confessed recently without a full confession at that particular time. It seems, however, that for some priests an absolution is a minimum for receiving each time. In fact, that's what happened last Pascha when we attended the OCA parish near us.

BOB

Generally speaking, in the Russian Church, a Confession is required before each Communion. But Confession may be, and probably should be, done at the evening services before the Liturgy, rather than the same morning as the Liturgy.

Fr David Straut

Dear Bob,

I'm not trying to be critical, but I have to say something about the OCA and the Russian Orthodox Church. Though the North American Metropolia was once part of the Russian Church, and received autocephaly through negotiations with the Moscow Patriarchate, it isn't really Russian. It's sacramental practices never were the same as the Russian Church. The OCA's background is more former Greek Catholic than Russian.

Fr David Straut

Dear Fr. David,

Would it be fairer to state that not all OCA parishes have a Russian background? Many of my friends grew up in Russian parishes that became OCA. It would be difficult to tell them that they have a Greek Catholic background. There were also such parishes that did not come into the OCA and remained Russian, becoming ROCOR parishes or being accepted into another jurisdiction.

nun Alexandra

Not that I'm nitpicking, but I'm beginning to have the impression that confession in the Orthodox Church is not the same as in the Catholic Church. In the Catholic Church, confession is quite detailed; one must detail all of one's mortal sins (as far as memory allows) and the number of times each kind of sin was committed (as far as possible).

When one is confessing only venial sins, then not all need to be confessed and it is permitted to simply say "I have sinned against charity, against justice, etc."

In the Orthodox Church, is confession merely a generalized confession that one has sinned?

I wonder where you got this strange idea about Confession in the Orthodox Church? It really seems a bit insulting, though I'm sure you did not mean it to be so.

Confession in the Orthodox Church is confession of actual sins, not a an admission of a state of sinfulness. It is true that we do not make a big distinction between 'mortal' and 'venial' sins. Penitents generally confess whatever sins they are aware of. There is no 'pass' for 'venial' sins. I've never felt that exact numbers are important, unless the number is significant for some reason. But an indication of how often a sin has been committed is certainly important in Confession. Also Confession, in my experience, involves penitents relating a great many problems they are experiencing, as well as actual confession of specific sins, and getting the priest's advice about these things.

When Confessions are brief, as Alice descibed them, it is usually an indication that the person confessing is a regular communicant, going to Confession almost every week.

Fr David Straut

Yes, Ofcourse I understood this.

I am sorry if anyone of another tradition misunderstood the detailed sacrament and spiritual hospital that Orthodox confession is from this statement...

For what it is worth to those who misunderstood, in these frequent confessions which I have noticed in the Russian church and also in monasteries in Greece, as well as some Greek churches in the U.S., the time of confession is not all that short...the only thing that is short is the lengthy advice from the priest which someone else, who does not have the spiritual growth yet of these persons, or who does not confess as often, might need to hear.

When one confesses as frequently as these persons do, they know the sins they are struggling with, so they do not anything other than to be forgiven.

In Christ,
Alice

Dear Mother (Sister?) Alexandra,

There are a few parishes made up largely of Russians in the OCA (Sea Cliff, Long Island, for example), just as there are a few parishes founded by Greek Catholics in the Russian Church Abroad (perhaps Mayfield, Pennsylvania). Most parishes in both bodies certainly have a mixture of people of various backgrounds: Russian, Ukrainian, Carpatho-Russian, converts, etc. Yet there is a big difference in ethos and liturgical practice between the OCA and the Russian Orthodox Church.

There certainly are parts of the OCA that are more Russian in practice (the West Coast, for example). However, I know of nowhere in the OCA where the priest expects a Confession before every Communion, whereas this is really the norm in the Russian Church, inside and outside of Russia.

With the hope that the upcoming Great Fast will be spiritually profitable for us both, I am

Yours in Christ,

Fr David

For what it's worth, I think that the "former Greek Catholic" influence on the OCA is highly overrated. It's been 3 or 4 generations since those old-guard parishes were founded by ex-Greek Catholics. The vast majority of those parishes adopted Great Russian practice and music within the first generation. The centers of clerical education--St. Platon's, St. Tikhon's, St. Vladimir's--followed the practice of the Russian Church to one degree or another, and educated the clergy in this tradition. The development and subsequent outcome of the OCA surely differs from ROCOR's, but I don't know if the reason is ex-Greek Catholic influence.

Now, I'm not sure if anyone on this thread has said this, but I don't think one can chalk up the OCA's practice regarding Confession and Communion to ex-Greek Catholic influence. Infrequent Communion was the norm in Greek Catholic churches just as in Orthodox churches, and thus Bob's above point about a 1 to 1 correlation between Confession and Communion generally applied to Greek Catholics (and Roman Catholics, for that matter). In the OCA, when frequent Communion began to be promoted, there was a question among many (both lay and ordained) about the connection between Confession and Communion. Some maintained the 1 to 1 correlation, and began having very brief weekly confessions, General Confessions (either private or public), or simply read the prayer of absolution.

Dave

I think in Russian practice confession before each Communion is normal but that's because like in mediæval Western Catholic practice infrequent Communion is normal.

In the OCA answering yes to 'Are you Orthodox [home.comcast.net]?' suffices for a stranger to receive Communion.

As most here know the OCA is mostly former Greek Catholic [angelfire.com] in background (at least 60 per cent are their descendants) not Russian but I agree it doesn't make that much difference now - that was 100 years ago and their church practice was largely russified very early on. But it's americanised Russian church usage (Gregorian calendar and English); ROCOR's more Russian, probably partly by choice and partly because they've only been in American half as long (WWII refugees: displaced persons), Julian calendar and Slavonic.

Right after WWII the American Slavs in the Metropolia/now-OCA and the recent refugee Russians didn't mix; the latter started ROCOR parishes. I know there were some hard feelings back then when the Metropolia said it wasn't under ROCOR.

AFAIK the only ex-Greek Catholic parishes in ROCOR are Mayfield and maybe a few others like it, old Metropolia/OCA parishes that switched when most of the OCA dumped Slavonic and switched calendars in the 1970s.

I remember reading somewhere in this Forum that many ROCOR parishes attempted to shift to English in the past, only to go back to Slavonic due to the demands of the faithful. True?

As for OCA "Russian" churches, the old calendar OCA cathedral in Brooklyn seems to be very Russian. And doesn't St. Tikhon's still use Slavonic?

By the way, I had a funny observation. For their Nativity Divine Liturgies, the ROCOR and MP Exarchate bishops used white, while Met. Jonah of OCA used red -- which is the Muscovite practice.

Dear Fr. David,

I agree that there is a different ethos between the current OCA and Russian practice. That difference has occurred over the years, an ethnic potpourri of priests and laity contributing, but not solely attributable to Greek influence.

I also agree with your assessment of OCA priests not expecting confession prior to every communion. I know only of 1 priest in the OCA who did that and he is now retired.

Today I was thinking and praying about why so many people do not go to confession. That seems to be the real crux of the matter.

Thank you for your response and kind words that Great Lent be spiritually profitable. I will remember you in prayer.

In Christ,
Mother Alexandra

AFAIK true.

That would make sense in Brooklyn as well because of recent immigration.