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Icognitus... perhaps someone with this "lay ministry" in their temple can come forth and divulge their reasoning behind lay communion distribution.

I thought Fr Deacon Lance had made the point of Extraordinary ministers clear in his post: As a deacon, I serve as an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion according to the Particular Law of the Metropolia of Pittsburgh, ie when we have over 150 faithful receiving the Eucharist.

As a layman, I served as an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion. We have a retired priest in residence, who celebrated the Divine Liturgy when Fr Rector was extremely ill and in bed. Although he can stand, the retired priest has a limited use of manual dexerity, thus Fr Rector directed me to distribute the Eucharist by myself. This was certainly not an ordinary event, and fit within the definition of the Particular Law.

Being a Latin, I will not receive communion from a EMHC...I will receive from a Deacon or Priest, this creation has produced a division within the Latin Rite, as if it needed more.

james

On a few occassions when our priest is away we have had a deacon come from another parish to serve a Typika. I'm not under the impression that this is an uncommon practice.

I still cannot fathom the idea that under normal circumstances women or someone without holy orders conferred on them would handle the chalice and the mysteries. I am equally at a loss to comprehend minor orders as a form of "discrimination".

I think that trying to find alternatives to holy tradition just complicates things more. Another solution is to go to communion when a priest celebrates, but to trust that God will continue His work with or without that availability. Even with elaborate canon laws there are unknowns that can and do enter into our reception of the Mysteries themselves.

You mentioned "minor clerics." How interesting. Let's ignore the "75 Rule" for now. Does any bishop in the Metropolia even believe in them? Why welcome lay ministers of the Eucharist and not minor clerics, especially subdeacons? Where can I get a copy of the liturgical text for formally installing Eucharistic Ministers and Mary/Martha Ministers? Is this a tradition we share with the Orthodox?

Canonically and legally, is the Church responsible for its volunteer "ministers" in the same way as its ordained clergy and minor orders? If so, this may explain some of the reason for the preference for ministries being done by lay persons.

If the church will allow a lay person to perform ministries that minor orders can do, then why not acknowledge that particular ministry properly in a 'churchy' way by making them minor orders? Why go half way with only Metropolitan programs and lay "commissioning" services? Why not do it the traditional way?

If our bishops can dress up like Orthodox ones, why not do what Orthodox bishops do? Why the pretending?

Joe

Yep, nobody seems to care.

Good questions all, Joe. Again, I go back to my premise: that we're Catholic and not Orthodox.

John K

And yet as a Catholic I do not necessarily HAVE to receive communion from anyone other than an ordained priest. I CAN choose not to. I am sure there are those who disagree or who would find that difficult to accept, however. There is really no way to effectively require people to receive from someone whom they see as not qualified to give.

Are their currently eucharistic ministers other than deacons/priests in the Byzantine Catholic church?

Well, Pyrohy, apparently no one who has responded so far can say they have lay eucharistic ministers at work in their parishes distributing communion. Perhaps a search of the Forum for related threads would help you get a more definitive answer, but the Forum itself is also unofficial when it comes to being able to give final answers.

I certainly care - quite passionately - about departing from Orthodox usage and tradition, especially since the Catholic Church has enjoined us not to do that.

Greek-Catholics are Catholics, obviously. That does not in the least mean that we are therefore not Orthodox.

The case that Father Deacon mentioned - the infirm priest who could manage to celebrate the Liturgy but could not manage to distribute Holy Communion - obviously qualifies as an emergency. If it should be a "persistent emergency", so to speak, it's up to the bishop to provide an adequate person - such as a deacon. If no deacon is available but there is a deacon candidate, then ordain him to the diaconate with restricted functions until he has completed what the required studies may be.

Incognitus

Incognitus--

I certainly did not mean to imply that you or anyone who feels for and loves passionately the Greek Catholic faith, does not care. (And when I said "we're Catholic, not Orthodox," it was said with the utmost sarcasm ) But what I do mean to say is that, under the guise of renewal, new models are being introduced in the Church that follow Roman Catholic lines rather than Orthodox ones. Be this in the establishment of new ministries, revision of the Liturgies, and overall general polity. It all make things very neat and sterile and easy and the same.

The Greek Catholic faith in this country has lived through much in it's history since the establishment of that first parish in Shennandoah, PA. There has been schism, bloodshed, coersion, complacency, and yet it has survived. Now we turn, IT SEEMS, down a path of renewal, prompted by the Holy Father(s) that we return to our legitimate patrimony, and again, IT SEEMS, that we follow the path blazed by the Roman Church nearly 4 decades ago instead of looking to the Mother Orthodox Churches from whence we came in the 16th and 17th centuries.

This is not to say that the Orthodox Churches do everything in the best way, and have no problems of their own in these regards. But to FURTHER distance ourselves from Orthodox practice and ritual truly leads to creating us as the half-bloods that both Rome and Orthodoxy see us as. Once the foot is in the door, there is no going back and closing it. Do many of our parishes need renewal? YES! Do we want to return to low masses, May crownings, stations, and First Communions? Hopefully not! Are we looking to the Orthodox Churches for models and answers? That, TO ME, seems to be no. Is there STILL that much animosity that we cannot approach and dialogue with our Orthodox counterparts about these issues???

The Ukrainian Catholic Church in my hometown did exactly what you suggested. The priest was sick and could celebrate the Liturgy, seated before the Holy Table, but that was all. Bishop Basil sent a deacon there, who distributed the Gifts among other functions until the priest could no longer serve as pastor and retired before his repose. Vichnaja jim pamjat!

I don't want to sound like a whiner or troublemaker, but I am concerned, and passionate about who we are and where we're going as a Church. For what it's worth...

John K

I've attended Liturgy at a Ukrainian Orthodox church where their deacon assists with the distribution of the Gifts.


There are a couple OCA churches in the area where young girls in the congregation hold the cloth while the priest distributes Communion.

At one of the churches the girls wear white robes, which are similar in appearance to Roman Catholic altar servers robes, down to the rope belts.

I've wondered why this was done, because there were ample altar servers at both churches to hold the cloths and while the Communion was distributed to the congregation the altar servers just "hung out" in the altar.

Anyone else seen this done before?

In Christ,
Aaron

Aaron, the OCA churches you mention probably do not have the girls go into the sanctuary for a blessing first, right?