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Mar 25th, 2025
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Joined: May 2003
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic: Dear Amici, 
A question about some RC devotions that I grew up with . . .
It seemed to me that the scapular and the Miraculous Medal were in the forefront because wearing them guaranteed one wasn't going to go to hell, if one prayed etc.
That is how I seemed to have interpreted those devotions.
Is that a correct view? How should one view them?
Is not the view that the Brown Scapular "guarantees" salvation a kind of "Catholic Calvinism" where one is "saved" and does this not introduce a kind of "spiritual relaxation" with respect to spiritual struggle in the Life of Christ that shouldn't be there?
Alex Dr. Alex, I know many RC who view the Scapular as some kind of magical amulet, but I wear mine as more of a reminder than any kind of 'magic escape hatch'. Many years ago I did something extremely stupid and attempted suicide...I was told later that my hand was clutched so hard around my Scapular when they got me to the ER, that the ER team gave up trying to get it off of me. Did the Scapular keep me from dying? No, I hadn't taken enough pills to really do myself any harm. Did I think that by holding the Scapular I would escape Hell? I don't know what I was thinking, or if I was thinking at all at that point. But now I wear my Scapular always, to remind me that no matter how bad I feel, no matter how bad things get, there is Someone who loves me and will take care of everything. I guess you can say that my Scapular does, in a way, save me from damnation, just not the way most people think. Vie
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Originally posted by Dr. Eric: Dr. Alex
As one invested in the scapular (except I gave mine to a soldier who was on his way to Iraq the last time I was on a plane) I wore mine "religiously."
The scapular is a sign of devotion to the Theotokos, it's kinda like being wrapped in her mantle. The devotion says that whoever dies clothed in it won't go to hell and will get out of purgatory on Saturday.
Some legends have said that people have tried to kill themselves and it didn't work until they took off the scapular. One in particular tried to drown himself and washed back ashore, tried to hang himself and the rope broke, and I think he finally took it off and got runover by a car or something! 
Really, it is a sign of devotion to and the protection of the Most Holy Virgin Mother of God. But to put in it an intrinsic kind of magic power would be to slip into the sin of superstition. So, it isn't an Ex Cathedra kind of thing but a pious devotion. Like the other approved Marian apparitions, ie. Knock, Guadalupe, Lourdes, Fatima, Medjugorie (no, wait that has been suppressed by the local bishops, yet people still go!) You are free to believe or disbelieve and it really doesn't affect your salvation. Dr. Eric, I wish I had read your post before I had added my own reply. I love the image of the Mantle! I think that is exactly why I wear mine. Someone once told me that if I was clutching my end of my Scapular that awful day, she bet that Our Lady was holding Her end even harder! Remember the toddler 'leashes' that were a big thing for a while? My Scapular attaches me to my Mother and as long as I keep holding on, I know I won't wander too far or get hurt. Vie
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Just a curiosity here, that may interest the scapular weareres among us. At the Battle of Little Bighorn, where a variety of Native American tribes massacred Goerge Armstrong Custers cavalry, one of the few soldiers who was not mutilated after death was the very Irish and very RC Capt. M. Keogh. The reason? He was wearing a scapular, which was regarded as some sort of mystical talisman. I knew that trivia would come in handy one day. So anyone out there going to Chechnya, Iraq, Egypt..anywhere really. You never know...
NW
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Ned,
Thanks for that Little Bighorn tidbit...the Indians were mainly Lakota (Sioux) & Cheyenne...who had previously had warned Custer...who validated his arrogance...guess he had trouble hearing.
james
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Ned,
Which is why I gave mine to Private Johnson who was on his way to Iraq as I was going to California.
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Eric you went to to California without a scapular! You mad! I hope he gave you his machine gun as a Fair trade.  ICXC NIKA
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He's actually in demolition, he should have given me some C-4! But that wouldn't do me any good unless I wanted to blow something up.
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Dr. Eric, When you visit Kalifornia, please come with alot of spiritual armor...the new age movement is rampant...besides the other oddities... james
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Jakub, the last time I posted about going to California, I got jumped by those who live there for saying the exact same things as you are saying! 
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I, also, have worn the Carmelite brown scapular for a very long time. I have always loved the Carmelite spirituality and have a great devotion to St. Therese of Lisieux, and her 'little way'. One little bit I thought I would pass on to you, is a little prayer I found somewhere a long time ago that helps you to keep in mind the very reason we wear the scapular, and that is, after kissing your scapular, say "Our Lady of Mt. Carmel, protect me this day (or night) from mortal sin, from deliberate sin, from hell and from purgatory."
simplicity
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Anything we put on ourselves that will remind us to pray or to dedicate ourselves to God through His saints is a beautiful thing, in my humble opinion.  In Christ, Alice
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Dear Ned,
A similar story occurred with our Etienne Brule up here, a Frenchman who lived in the time of the North American Jesuit Martyrs and who was ultimately cannibalized for his untoward actions toward First Nations women . . .
He was captured by the Iroquois and they began to torture him. They noticed the Agnus Dei that he wore around his neck and tried to take it from him to observe it at closer range.
But Etienne, in pain and suffering though he was, warned them that if they touched the sacred object, his God would punish them severely . . .
At that moment, a dark cloud came above them and lightning was seen. The chief ordered Etienne to be released and he took him into his own long-house and dressed his wounds himself.
When Etienne fully recovered, the chief ordered his braves to escort him back to the French and let him go . . .
Could you explain more about the "Agnus Dei?"
Alex
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Alex,
I am actually unaware of the "Agnus Dei". Could you please elaborate for us easterners.
In IC XC,
Father Anthony+
Everyone baptized into Christ should pass progressively through all the stages of Christ's own life, for in baptism he receives the power so to progress, and through the commandments he can discover and learn how to accomplish such progression. - Saint Gregory of Sinai
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Fr. Anthony,
To the best of my humble memory, Agnus Dei = Lamb of God, a Latin liturgical prayer...
Lamb of God, You take away the sins of the world, have mercy on us.
repeat...
Lamb of God, You take away the sins of the world, grant us peace.
As for a certain object, I'm in the dark...
james
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James,
I have heard of the prayer, but never the sacramental. That is why i am asking.
In IC XC,
Father Anthony+
Everyone baptized into Christ should pass progressively through all the stages of Christ's own life, for in baptism he receives the power so to progress, and through the commandments he can discover and learn how to accomplish such progression. - Saint Gregory of Sinai
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