www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Hi..I'm new

Mary Elizabeth,

That may well be, I'm just telling you what was a not uncommon occurence and way of thinking in the early part of the 20th century among those of many of the Eastern Churches. You have to remember that these were generally folks who were separated from the mainstream by language and not always well-received or pastorally cared for by the principally Irish and German clergy and hierarchs of the time. Thus, the relative security, sanctuary, safety, whatever you chose to term it, of their fellow countrymen and women was often comforting.

Many years,

Neil

Hello Saint Pete!

Thank's for the blessings, God be with you always.

Not so! There is a distinction beween dogma and the doctine of the church. Please try not to confuse the doctrine of the Latin church with dogma for the universal communion.

I would like to suggest that if you would like to dialogue with eastern Catholics and Orthodox to do a little light reading on the beliefs of Eastern Catholics. It will preserve you from a lot of anxiety. It could be very interesting.

The archives will contain many suggested reading lists buried in threads started by people interested in such things, look them over!
There is a difference between the Holy Father's function as the Patriarch of the West and his function as the Supreme Pontiff.

Clerical Celibacy is a discipline of the Latin church, as described elsewhere.

In Christ Our Lord,
Michael

Mary Elizabeth,

You write: Yes, there is one faith, one baptism and one Lord of all. In that sense, the Church is the Church. But in a very real sense there are different "flavors". Your comment might be akin to saying a milkshake is a milkshake (frappe if you're in Boston). But a chocolate milkshake is not a vanilla milkshake.

Most of the Eastern Catholic Churches have a corresponding Orthodox Church. For example, my Melkite Church is the Catholic "side" of the Antiochian Orthodox Church. Because style of worship and theological expression is the same between the two Churches it's quite reasonable for one to say if there's no Melkite Church then go to the Antiochian Church. In fact, in the Middle East there's usually only a Melkite or an Antiochian Church in any givne town, so you go to whatever is in the town where you are.

What you have stated is pretty consistent with the Latin Church's teaching which presupposes that the Church is a monolithic organization that is the same everywhere. While that may be mostly true for the Latin Church, it really isn't true for the communion of Churches that form the Catholic Church.

Edward, deacon and sinner

The restriction on married clergy in North America was removed in 1999. We have a priest who assists at our parish who is married. He was ordained in Ukraine.

Mary Elizabeth,

Christ is in our Midst!

Welcome to the forum. I applaud your interest in your brothers and sisters in the Eastern Churches.

I would recommend as others have that you do some reading in the faqs regarding some of these things. I would also recommend checking out Anthony Dragani's page www.East2West.org. [east2west.org.] You'll find very good explanations in these two places geared toward people in exactly your position. There are many presumptions regarding the Church among Roman Catholics that do not take into account the Church as a communion of Churches (I might add that the coin has two sides).

With a little light reading, I think you can become a valuable member of our forum!

Justin

First of all, welcome to our little forum, SP, and happy St. Nicholas Day to all on the old calendar (and happy birthday to my Uncle Nicholas and all you Nicholases out there).

I'd make a couple quick observations in all good nature and sense of fellowship:

1) Not everyone who posts here is a Catholic of either the Eastern or Roman persuasion, so you may read postings that reflect different view points. There are different kinds of folks here, including some of our Orthodox and Protestant brethren who obviously see some things differently. I think we learn by hearing their viewpoints and by our hopefully good natured and brotherly/sisterly discussion and debate.

2) I'd also observe that Catholics who are in the various Eastern churches in union with Rome are sometimes more attentive to the spiritual aspects and less to the legalistic aspects of the faith. That doesn't mean we ignore doctrines or traditions, although sometimes our traditions are obviously different.

3) On the subject of the married priesthood, I've YET to meet a single Byzantine who thinks women should be priests. (Granted, there are zillions of Byzantines whom I have not met - and maybe someone on this forum will step up and correct me here.) As I observe it, we don't connect those unrelated things (married men and feminism) in our happy Eastern minds. Or perhaps, we recognize that the spirituality and spiritual lives of men and women are different and that being a priest is not a "job" that is a matter for "equal opportunity," but a calling to serve the faithful that is uniquely male. Whether the male called to the priesthood is married or not does not seem to connect to any feminist agenda in our minds. (Besides, many of us prefer our priests with beards! And, ew, well, that doesn't work with most women.) ;-)

4) In my own experience, your average Byzantine embraces the moral teachings from the Holy See better than the average Roman Catholic. We don't expect the Holy Father to change his mind on abortion, contraception, women in the priesthood, or whatever the issue is, because we expect to receive moral guidance and we accept that the easy way is too often the sinful way. You won't find a lot of people who adhere to groups like Catholic for a Free Choice in our ranks. That's just not who we are.

5) I don't like to see people leave the Catholic Church. I'd like to see more people find their way to us on their spiritual journeys through this life. :-) But I fully appreciate the Orthodox as my dear friends and cousins, literally (in many cases), and figuratively. I hope some day that what was broken so many centuries ago will be restored and greet them in all good fellowship as true apostolic Christians, following the example of JP2 (God grant him many years!).

My bottom line summary:

Byzantines: Different But Loyal.

(Can we get that on a bumper sticker, ya think?)

OK, I give up. Why would Saint Peter be prostrate before his own chair? I have chairs in my house - in fact I'm sitting on a chair in my office right this minute - but it has never occurred to me to prostrate myself in front of them, nor in front of the rest of the furniture, for that matter (there are, I am told, people who prostrate themselves before their TV sets, however). Incognitus

Well...........Ultramontanism????

A Bhriain, a chara! Well, I suppose it might be ultramontanism if the chair in question is a sedan chair and Saint Peter is about to head for the hills! Nollaig shona dhuit! Incognitus

Dear Mary Elizabeth,
I'm not sure where in Alabama you are but there is a St Elias Maronite Church in Birmingham. If you are within a reasonable drive you may want to visit. I know, too, that there are a lot of former Maronites, now Roman, around Mobile, information I've gleaned from a former Anglican friend there who is starving for liturgical beauty. Unfortunately for him, there are no Eastern Catholic churches within a hundred miles or so, and I don't even know where the nearest Byzantine parish is...
-daniel n

May the Peace of Christ be with you all,

I've spent most of the day reading here and at other sites about the Eastern Catholic Churches. I have acted in error I leaped, hopped, and even jumped to all sorts of conclusions about you all. I must say that the orthodoxy (little "o" as in right believing) of the Eastern Catholic Churches is absolutely remarkable when compared with the history of mistreatment they've recieved at the of their Eastern and Western brothers.

I'd also like to say that it amazes me that Eastern Catholics have remained as unfenching loyal to Rome as they have,particularly in the light of the suppressions and latinization enforced by the Roman Hierarchy and the Holy Fathers. Eastern Catholics are living proof of why unity inn diversity is necessary.

Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa, Mea Maxima Culpa.

in the Sacred Heart and the Immaculata,

prostrate before you and begging pardon for the rash judgments of an Alabama housewife trying to understand her heritage aand the richness of the heritage of the True Church in its fullnes,

your most humble servant

Mary Elizabeth

ps the nearest Byzantine Rite Catholic Church to just outside Atlanta, and I won't go to a non-Catholic Church for ANY reason (there's a Greek Orthodox Church in Montgomery, about 45 minutes from me). I've been to the Maronite Church, my Grandmother's brother Thomas's funeral liturgy was there a few months ago.

Mary Elizabeth,

There is a Melkite Catholic Church in Birmingham served by a Byzantine deacon, Deacon Stanley, the husband of forum regular Rose. I am sure they would be happy to have you come to Liturgy.

Fr. Deacon Lance

Mary Elizabeth,

St. George the Great Martyr Melkite Greek-Catholic Church, 425 Sixteenth Avenue South, Birmingham, AL 35205
(205) 252-5788

Father Frank Mileniewicz is the Pastor and, as Deacon Lance mentioned, newly-ordained Deacon Stan, husband of one of our forum members, also serves the parish.

Many years,

Neil

Thank you. I shall contact the Melkites.

May the Peace of Christ be with you all,

Birmingham is so far away, but I've instructed my daughter to go and see for me. She's going to write me a detailed description of the Liturgy. Maybe I'll be able to go when I visit my daughter and son-in-law there in March.

I'm actually hoping that he'll consider joining one of the Eastern Rites. He's an Episcopalian that has been pretty well convinced of Catholicism's thogical veracity, but the lack of reverence in Latin Parishes and the badly done Liturgy "turns him off".

under the Mantle of the Virgin,

prostrate before St Peter's Chair and sitting up with an irritable two y/o who wants "gwam cwackas",

your servant,

Mary Elizabeth