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#84510 02/02/04 03:16 AM
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Hello:

My Chaldean Cathedral just celebrated the memorial of St. Stephen the first martyr and head of the deacons. During the Holy Liturgy, the Gospel was read by mostly subdeacons instead of the priest, which is done annually during this Saint's memorial.

I would like to know if the reading of the Gospel by deacons and subdeacons instead of the priest during the memorial of St. Stephen is also an annual tradition in the Byzantine Churches? How about other Eastern Churches?

Also, for our Latin members, is this also a liturgical tradition in the Latin Church?

God bless,

Rony

#84511 02/02/04 04:39 AM
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Speaking with my Latin hat on here biggrin

With us the Gospel is read only by Priests and Deacons.

BUT there is an exception to this [ sorry about this] .If for Pastoral necessity there is a celebration of the Eucharist outwith Mass [ ie no Priest available and the Bishop has given permission for these services to be held] then during the Liturgy of the Word the Gospel may be read by the laity - normally this will be the lay person presiding at the service

#84512 02/02/04 10:16 AM
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I don't know if it is still the custom, but it used to be the custom among the Carthusian Nuns that on the day of her profession, a nun could wear the stole in the manner of a deacon (accross the shoulder), and chant the Gospel.

#84513 02/02/04 10:29 AM
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Dear Rony,

This is, as I understand it, a tradition of the Assyrian Church only.

But why "subdeacons?" If Stephen was a deacon, then could not a deacon reading the Gospel suffice to establish the symbolic association?

Alex

#84514 02/02/04 11:01 AM
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Dear Anhelyna,

Does such a lay-person need to have a special blessing and/or training to read the Gospel?

Alex

#84515 02/02/04 11:07 AM
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Dear Rony, in the Byzantine tradition the deacon is the normal proclaimer of the Gospel at the Divine Liturgy. At other times the priest specifically takes the Gospel (such as at Sunday Matins), but at the Divine Liturgy if there is a deacon present, he is appointed to proclaim the Gospel.

Subdeacons usually never proclaim a Gospel, with the exception of Pascha or Agape Vespers when the priest may bless others (even laity) to take a part of the Gospel in various languages.

#84516 02/02/04 11:18 AM
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Dear Diak,

Could you provide us with a brief overview of the full range of a subdeacon's activities - other than providing eagle-mats for bishops at the drop of a hat and seemingly out of nowhere?

Alex

#84517 02/02/04 11:33 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
Dear Anhelyna,

Does such a lay-person need to have a special blessing and/or training to read the Gospel?

Alex
Sadly no frown

However it is after all only those who are Comissioned as Extraordinary Ministers of the Eucharist who are permitted to do this - and the first time I was Comissioned it was done during Mass and yes, I was given a Blessing then [ that was at the end of several training sessions - but I understand this is not always the case frown ]

Training as a Reader - well that depends on the Parish . I am getting. rather annoyed with some of 'my' Readers who remind me, on a regular basis ,that they have been trained to 'proclaim the Reading - but they are the ones who read without understanding , and are anything but fluent and don't use the micrphone properly either frown

Hope that answers your Questions O Great Returned One :p

Anhelyna

#84518 02/02/04 11:36 AM
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Dear Anhelyna,

Who has returned?

You mean "Alex?"

The "Alex" that used to throw fits at the drop of a hat and then storm off?

No, that Alex will never come back here again.

I'll let him know that you miss him! smile

Alex

#84519 02/02/04 11:38 AM
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A Damascene conversion? Nothing wrong with the old Alex but if you felt you needed a change, then I am very happy for you! smile

#84520 02/03/04 02:22 AM
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Quote
But why "subdeacons?" If Stephen was a deacon, then could not a deacon reading the Gospel suffice to establish the symbolic association?
Dear Alex:

Our Cathedral is filled with subdeacons, and hardly any deacons. Even though I once heard from our priest that we had a deacon, to this day, I do not know which one among them is actually the ordained deacon. I don't even think he's present with the subdeacons or even a member of our Cathedral.

So, I suppose that traditionally the deacons were the ones who read the Gospel during the memorial of the Saint so as to establish the symbolic association as you said, but due to the lack of deacons in our Cathedral, the subdeacons fill that role. Also, it isn't just one subdeacon reading but several subdeacons in more than one language.

Occasionally, even male readers who stand with the subdeacons and are dressed in liturgical attire will read a portion of the Gospel during this memorial. However, I'm not really sure why they would be allowed to do so.

God bless

Rony

#84521 02/03/04 02:35 AM
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Shlomo Chaldean Catholic,
You may want to explain why our Churches (The Antiochene-Edessan) have so many sub-deacons. If you do not know I will fill in.

Poosh BaShlomo,
Yuhannon

#84522 02/03/04 03:28 AM
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Dear Yuhannon:

I myself always wondered why we had so many subdeacons. I mean, it's great to have them, and their presence in the solumn celebration of the Service of the Holy Mysteries is awsome, especially when they're all chanting in unison and complementing the prayers of the priest. However, I'm not really sure why we have so many of them, a lot more than deacons, and would be happy to have you fill in for me smile

God bless,

Rony

#84523 02/03/04 08:32 PM
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Shlomo Chaldean Catholic,
The reason is because, we believe that all people are part of the "priesthood." Within our Tradition, male babies were not only initiated, but also ordained to the Subdeaconhood. That is also the reason why subdeacons use to be able to get married after ordination.

Poosh BaShlomo,
Yuhannon


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